I find myself racing people with my TCS on cuz i forget to turn it off and im starting to wonder that maybe its a good thing.....I think.......cuz if it was turned off i would have crazy wheel spin and not get traction. I have only had my car for a week so maybe Iam out of mind for thinking this way.
-
Protip: Profile posts are public! Use Conversations to message other members privately. Everyone can see the content of a profile post.
Tcs Vs. No Tcs
- Thread starter NSX23
- Start date
- Joined
- 14 April 2002
- Messages
- 2,273
I thought it mattered but I have heard people test their car with it on/off and didn't see a difference.
The early model TCS was much maligned IMO. If you go out in the snow and are turning and stab the gas - the TCS feels very abrupt / weird and equally "shuts you down". You might conclude that it sucks at that point. I did before my NSX became my daily driver several years ago.
In the real world situations when you are not jumping on the gas in a turn and there is moderate wheel slippage that might no cause a full slide but might cause a skid - it works very subtlety to back off the gas. It usually happens so smoothly that you almost have to see the light go on to notice it.
I still turn it off at the track or in the summer when I am driving hard as I am ready and willing to have the additional control of the car. Other then that it stays on - ready to lend a helping hand.
The early model TCS was much maligned IMO. If you go out in the snow and are turning and stab the gas - the TCS feels very abrupt / weird and equally "shuts you down". You might conclude that it sucks at that point. I did before my NSX became my daily driver several years ago.
In the real world situations when you are not jumping on the gas in a turn and there is moderate wheel slippage that might no cause a full slide but might cause a skid - it works very subtlety to back off the gas. It usually happens so smoothly that you almost have to see the light go on to notice it.
I still turn it off at the track or in the summer when I am driving hard as I am ready and willing to have the additional control of the car. Other then that it stays on - ready to lend a helping hand.
To get some clarification when the TCS light is "on" in the pod then that means that Traction is turned off right?
Tan
Tan
There are two TCS lights. When the yellow light at the upper right on the dash gauges is on, it tells you that TCS is turned off. The green light in the middle of the tach lights up when TCS is activating (IOW when it is detecting wheel slippage).
I think that it is strictly a matter of preference whether to use the TCS or not. I have the SmarTCS installed and my TCS remains off 99% of the time. I do not have an incredible amount of horsepower so controlling wheelspin is not that bad of an issue especially since most of the weight of the car is sitting above the rear wheels. Strictly personal preference based on driving style though. --Paul
- Joined
- 14 April 2002
- Messages
- 2,273
NSX23 said:
BTW - quit racing people on the street. IMO street racing only proves who is most willing to die or endanger others - not who is fastest.
If you want to have the most fun you have ever had in the front seat of a car - come to a high performance driver's education at a racetrack near you!
If you go to www.drivingevents.com, sign up, and participate you will find an entirely new definition for fast and a complete appreciation for engineering behind the Acura NSX. You will also make friendships that last a lifetime IMO.
Ditto that sentiment. And emphasizing the "endanger others" part. Get to a DE event and sow your oats there. You really will enjoy it.
On topic: I left it off almost all the time when I had stock wheels. Though I only remember it activating a few times on track on corner exits. But it activated a few times on the street if the road was dusty or wet. Since yours is mostly street driven, I don't see why you would want to turn it off.
Ponyboy said:
I'm becoming more and more confused with the traction control too, Now since I have the diff. wheel and tires set up, the car had a more understeer tendency, however, in wet I found that whenever I went into a corner a little bit fast, come to throttle early, the rear end will start coming out, and I don't have guts to "see" how the TCS work, most of the time, as soon as it slide, I already caught myself counter steered and my foot off the throttle... The other day I was going through a off camber corner and I purposely getting one side of my tires on those reflectors, and then I did it again...
Sometime I try to "learn" the car at my work place (warehouse area) I turned off the TCS, and all I got was understeer, then if I purposedly put the car in first gear, I found the car is much easier to do donuts than drifting... The transition from understeer to oversteer was way too fast, Does that mean if I want to learn drifting the X, I would need to get much higher speed?? I'm more confused than ever...
No TCS at all
I have unplugged the computer on the street car over a year ago, and needless to say, the entire box has been taken out of the track car. I have not missed it in either one. My street car would occasionally bog down on hard 1-2 upshifts, which was really aggrevating. Without TCS, I no longer get that bogging. I do drive my street car every day now that I do not have the MINI, but will revert back to the Lexus now that it is winter (snow tires in correct Lexus size). BTW, the Lexus has no TCS or anything similar except ABS.
I have unplugged the computer on the street car over a year ago, and needless to say, the entire box has been taken out of the track car. I have not missed it in either one. My street car would occasionally bog down on hard 1-2 upshifts, which was really aggrevating. Without TCS, I no longer get that bogging. I do drive my street car every day now that I do not have the MINI, but will revert back to the Lexus now that it is winter (snow tires in correct Lexus size). BTW, the Lexus has no TCS or anything similar except ABS.
Correct me if I'm wrong ( here they come) the tcs dosent control your rear wheels but only the butterfly in your throttle body, closing it as it detects slippage and bogging down your engine.
Armando
Armando
But reducing the power to the engine affects/controls the rear wheels/tires... no?MiamieNeSeX said:
nsxtasy said:
Yes but not directly, its not a super computer controlling wheel spin as I used to think.
Armando
- Joined
- 18 November 2003
- Messages
- 148
While driving moderately to compensate for the rain (30mph in a 40mph zone) I felt my car hydroplane and during that moment the TCS light flickered.
Has anybody noticed that sometimes lanes on the roadway have groves where the tires most met the road. For example on rainy days I have to drive near or on the yellow line to avoid the rain that sets in the groves on the road.
Has anybody noticed that sometimes lanes on the roadway have groves where the tires most met the road. For example on rainy days I have to drive near or on the yellow line to avoid the rain that sets in the groves on the road.
Some roads have grooves (not groves) cut in them, to prevent cars from sliding laterally, particularly when the road is wet. They should give you better forward stability than the areas without the grooves.
MiamiNeSeX: It's not a super computer but I remember a statement in a Honda NSX brochure and in the german manual (I guess for the newer models) that the TCS system doesn't only reduce power to prevent wheel spin but is also capable of increasing power in certain situations.
You may know that you can loose the rear in a turn when you suddenly release throttle (load transfer). The statements claim that the TCS can prevent this - not sure if it really does because I mostly drive on the track with TCS off. Our club chiefs (one of them was involved in the final fine tuning of the NS-X prototype) recommend to turn it off at most of our tracks here.
huyduchoang: I guess that's a common experience - especialy with wide tires and reduced profile. This effect gets worse with a harder suspension - can even be felt on dry roads. Nothing a TCS system could prevent, maybe an ESP system would help.
Ken: I guess he was speaking of the grooves that are made by truck traffic etc. not by the street builders.
You may know that you can loose the rear in a turn when you suddenly release throttle (load transfer). The statements claim that the TCS can prevent this - not sure if it really does because I mostly drive on the track with TCS off. Our club chiefs (one of them was involved in the final fine tuning of the NS-X prototype) recommend to turn it off at most of our tracks here.
huyduchoang: I guess that's a common experience - especialy with wide tires and reduced profile. This effect gets worse with a harder suspension - can even be felt on dry roads. Nothing a TCS system could prevent, maybe an ESP system would help.
Ken: I guess he was speaking of the grooves that are made by truck traffic etc. not by the street builders.
Ponyboy said:
Ditto!
A few words from England: ( please read with such an accent )
" It's a fantastic car, but the traction control is awful. I always switch it off."
-Gordon Murray
Back to North America:
From my humble experience, when the TCS was working, it gave , on straight line, almost the same result than without it, in the sense that the car is slowing its acceleration; with the TCS on your engine is bogging down a bit for a short while, with the TCS off you're spinning the tires also for a short while!
Of course feeling that the engine is shutting its power off when mashing the throttle is like... losing your erection when entering
the matrix access...for a while.
It is during hard turning that I am the most perplex about it because sometimes it is not a good idea to ease on the throttle.
As far as you don't push your NSX very hard in moderate to high speed turns, keeping the TCS on isn't a big deal, otherwise, take Gordon Murray's advice!
Cheers everybody!
- Joined
- 3 February 2000
- Messages
- 3,942
NSX-Racer said:
TCS on the NSX varies considerably by year (and sometimes even within a model year).
Regarding the comment above about increasing power and/or preventing lift throttle oversteer:
Starting with the 1997 model year (in the US), the TCS system was changed so that it would maintain throttle if it felt you were going to cause an oversteer situation by lifting. It does not increase throttle, only maintains the level prior to your lifting. Previous model years would only cut throttle if TCS believed you were breaking too much traction due to excess throttle.
The TCS software has changed in many othrr ways over the years as well. I think the newer versions (1997 and later in particular) are much better than the older versions. They allow more leeway before taking action (you can throttle steer the car), and the newer versions are also smoother about the action they take.
Thanks for the clarification, Lud. Mine is a '98 so I should have that throttle maintainance feature - but as I said I never experienced the effect (maybe because I don't lift in a turn
)
)
...I have been disappointed with the unreliability of my 93's TCS....it seems to bog the engine down or let the wheels spin, not enough in between, obviously it's worse in the wet....where I would probably like it the most.
The green TCS light as far as I know has never come on/flickered (I've been looking out for it), apart from when I start the car...have got I a TCS problem, or is this typical of a '93?
I have stock wheels and tyres with good tread.
Any feedback greatly appreciated....
Simon.
The green TCS light as far as I know has never come on/flickered (I've been looking out for it), apart from when I start the car...have got I a TCS problem, or is this typical of a '93?
I have stock wheels and tyres with good tread.
Any feedback greatly appreciated....
Simon.
Last edited:
I have had two '91 auto, and I have seen the TCS light flicker (and obvious TCS activation) at two locations on my daily drive - both are RH turns going into a slight hill. If I take the turn a bit aggressively and then press down hard on the accelerator, the TCS invariably kicks in - doesn't matter wet or dry. If I remember to turn it off, then I can just drive up the hill.
My bad habit of flooring it when I'm straightened after the turn (from my MR-2 auto) probably doesn't help it any
My bad habit of flooring it when I'm straightened after the turn (from my MR-2 auto) probably doesn't help it any
....any ideas on why the Green TCS light does not illuminate on my '93 manual when TCS is operating would be greatly received...
Thanks.
Thanks.
Bad bulb?
....all bulbs are ok...the bulb illuminates when I turn the ignition on initially...
