Canon Digital SLR Recommendations

[Ojas]

It’s been over a month since the last "which camera should I buy?" thread, so I’ll start a new one.

I’m in the market for my first digital SLR camera and am leaning towards Canon. They seem to have a nice rebate offer on the Rebel XT, D20, lenses, and printers. For example, there is a $75 rebate on the Rebel XT, but this is doubled if another item is purchased or tripled if two other items are purchased. So, up to $225 back on Rebel XT or up to $300 back on the D20 plus the rebates in the accessories, which are also doubled or tripled.

I was originally thinking of starting with the Canon Digital Rebel XT along with some lenses, but I’m not really sure what would be best. I understand the importance of having a quality lens and realize I can use them in the future when I upgrade cameras, but it’s hard for me to justify buying professional lenses since I am just starting out. Although, it seems like having a non-pro lens with image stabilizer would be very useful, especially in a tele lens. Is it?

For my use, it seems like a standard zoom and a telephoto zoom lens would do the job. However, several newbie guides I have read recommend purchasing a fixed lens instead of a zoom one (mostly for quality). So, I’m not sure if I should also have a fixed lens.

If you wanted to stay under $1400 after rebates, what would you do? Here are some ideas...

Maybe I don’t need to spend much...<table style="border: 1px solid rgb(170, 170, 170); padding: 5px; width: 350px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td>Rebel XT w/ EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6</td><td align="right">$850</td></tr><tr><td>EF 75-300mm f/4-5.6 III USM</td><td align="right">$190</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$1040</td></tr><tr><td>rebates ($80 x 2)
</td><td align="right">-$160</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total after rebates</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$880</td></tr></tbody></table>
Inexpensive route with IS tele lens...<table style="border: 1px solid rgb(170, 170, 170); padding: 5px; width: 350px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td>Rebel XT w/ EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6</td><td align="right">$850</td></tr><tr><td>EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM</td><td align="right">$550</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$1400</td></tr><tr><td>rebates ($90 x 2)</td><td align="right">-$180</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total after rebates</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$1220</td></tr></tbody></table>
It’s not much more to get IS in both lenses...<table style="border: 1px solid rgb(170, 170, 170); padding: 5px; width: 350px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td>Rebel XT</td><td align="right">$750</td></tr><tr><td>EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM</td><td align="right">$550</td></tr><tr><td>EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM</td><td align="right">$400</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$1700</td></tr><tr><td>rebates ($105 x 3)</td><td align="right">-$315</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total after rebates</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$1385</td></tr></tbody></table>
Good body, but no fancy lenses...<table style="border: 1px solid rgb(170, 170, 170); padding: 5px; width: 350px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td>20D</td><td align="right">$1240</td></tr><tr><td>EF 50mm f/1.4 USM</td><td align="right">$300</td></tr><tr><td>EF 75-300mm f/4-5.6 III USM</td><td align="right">$190</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$1730</td></tr><tr><td>rebates ($120 x 3)</td><td align="right">-$360</td></tr><tr><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;">total after rebates</td><td style="border-top: 2px solid black;" align="right">$1370</td></tr></tbody></table>

 

[amg_nsx]

Get the body with the most flexibility. I shoot with Nikon (D100, D70 and D200 on order) and have agonized over similar decisions. From what I've read of Canon, the Rebel is missing several features that you may want later. I've used a 20D and found it to be a great camera. My gut feel is that a 20D is a camera you can learn on and also "grow" with, whereas the Rebel will begin to annoy you with limitations as you become a better photog. PM me and I'll be glad to go into more detail if you're interested.

 

[Acura NsX Pilot]

I would get the 20D but would opt to get the wide angle zoom rather then the 50mm prime lens. The 18-55mm is a rather cheap lens and you could still get it for under $200 and add it onto the package and be right at $1400 more or less. If you dont already know about the 1.6x conversion factor for the DSLR's this means your lens is actually 1.6 times what it actually is so your 50mm would be 80mm view wise.

 

[Acura NsX Pilot]

I dont know where you got your prices from but I did some research for you and came up with these.

http://www.beachcamera.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=E1CNEOS20D1855

$1541.48 - $100 mail in rebate = $1441.48

There is also a buy it now price of

$1351.48 after instant buy now savings and mail in rebate

http://www.beachcamera.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=E1CNEOS20D1855

These prices are for the 20D kit w/ 18-55mm lens

Body only

http://www2.buydig.com/shop/product.aspx?utm_id=17&ref=pricegrabber&sku=CNEOS20D

$1281.99




All prices from Pricegrabber.com ........ both companies are the same place and I have used beach many times for purchases and they are top notch. If you would like to use B n H camera which many recommend Im sure they will match the price but if you live in ny you will have to pay sales tax there.

 

[IsR]

I bought myself Rebel XT, was in you predicament not long before I decided to buy the XT and my brother-in-law bought the 20D.And good for Acura Nsx Pilot to point out 1.6x conversion factor which does make a different.
For me I'm happy with my camera- right now not utilising which requires the 20D features., as I see it by the time I'm 'comfortable' enough with DSLR there may be something new in the market to upgrade to-by then I hope I know what I want. One thing which is apparent to me other then good lenses is a good flash,I've tried out the 580EX- recomended(IMO).
Can't go wrong with good lenses as long as the future camera body supports it. EF 70-300mm - thats a good zoom lens.I got my self "EF LENS WORK 3"The Eyes of EOS book for lenses guide. And I am still learning. :smile:

 

[DocL]

The Rebel XT is a fantastic camera. I bought one as a backup for my 10D. The only thing that I don't like about it is that it feels cheap compared to the 10D. The 10D has a Magnessium body, whereas the Rebel is all plastic. But there is a big weight diference that makes the Rebel a little more enjoyable to carry around all day.

As for the lenses, don't get that 75-300mm because it's a crappy slow lens. There are better lenses by Cannon and aftermarket companies such as Sigma, Tamaron, etc.

You must also realize that once you dive into the DSLR realm that you are also going to have to learn how to process the images in Photoshop. So not only are you going to be spending close to $1,000 for a decent camera, but if you don't already have PS, you are going to have to buy it or a similar product to get the most out of your photos. Oh yeah, then you'll need to buy a good printer. The spending get's crazy once you dive into DSLR photography, but it's a great hobby once you become comfortable with the technology.

Instead of adding useless items to that package just to get a discount, buy the body and get the Cannon 28-135mm f3.5-5.6/IS/USM. It will give you more useable range and having the Image Stability (IS) is a great feature.

-Cheers

 

[rickysals]

I havent really used any Canon's ever. Most of the people I know in our tiny lil circle use Nikons. The D200 was just released, and my roommate wishes he had waited to buy that, over his D2X.

I had Canon shoved down my throat the other nite, when I ate dinner with me and about 8 other students, a Canon rep, and David Hume Kennerly; so I'm a tad sick of hearing about Canon.

 

[queenlives]

It’s been over a month since the last "which camera should I buy?" thread, so I’ll start a new one.

he may shoot me for saying this in public, but i'd ask rob and give **serious** consideration to his thoughts:
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61466

 

[Hiroshima]

Just upgraded from the original D-Rebel to the new XT. Really like it. The 20D, in my case did not offer enough of a upgrade over the XT to really justify the extra $400. There is tons of info on the differences between the two on the net, but for me the extra functions avaliable on the 20D were not necessary for my type of shooting. I am an advanced ameture at best.

IMHO, spend the extra cash on a lens. It make MUCH more of a difference than what body you choose. Lenses hold their value (especially the L series) and they hold their value for a reason. Body's progress but great glass is great glass no matter what body you put them on.

If I were you and was going to spend around $1400, I would get the XT kit, and the 70-200 F4 L. The 70-200 is the cheapest L lens you can get but it shoots amazing pics. You can get the kit lens, which is not really very good unless you stop it down to F8, and save you money for either the 17-40 F4L, the 28-70 F2.8L, or the new 24-105 IS L. The 17-40 is my next lens and is fairly reasonable at about $700. The 28-70 is about $1200 and out of my price range. The 24-105L is also over $1000 but has a nice range. IMHO with the 1.6 crop factor a 24 or a 28 wide end is not wide enough. That is why I want the 17-40. I will have a gap between 40-70 but that is why I have my 50 prime and legs that work.

To fill a wider range you can get a Sigma 18-125 DG lens for $259 which is pretty decent and pretty well reviewed. Not L quality, but has a nice usable range. (I have this as well and use it quite a bit)

IMHO, you should follow others advice and NOT get the lenses you have listed because you WILL upgrade them. Once you shoot L, you will NEVER GO BACK and if you can start your bag with good glass, you should. What they have said about the 75-300 III is right. That lens is crap.

My other advice is to pick up the cheaper printer that is also on the rebate and give it as an X-Mas Gift. That way you can tripple rebate your other items and give a nice gift for a nice price.

Other quick picks for lenses is obviously the 50 1.8 MkII. Cheap at $80 and sharp as a tack. Fast at 1.8 as well.

Last piece of advice. Make sure you buy from a Canon Authoized dealer. They will only honor the rebate if you purchase from an Authorized dealer. Buydig and BeachCamera are the same company and both are authorized. 17th Street Photo is also authorized and usually has some of the best prices on Canon equip.

Mantra:
Buy Good Glass, Buy Good Glass, Buy Good Glass.

 

[akira3d]

CANON, CANON, CANON!

I'll second the recommendations on L series lenses and, if you're at all on the fence of going with the D20 and getting cheap lenses, I'd say stick with one of the Digital Rebels and spend the extra bucks on L series lenses.

And, if you only can afford one L series lens, l highly recommend Canon's EF 16-35mm F2.8/L USM...this has been my workhorse lens since going digital and, with the crop factor on these DSLRs, it is also a necessity if you plan to shoot anything wide angle. Almost everyone I know who has a Canon DSLR has this lens in their arsenal. Of course, this lens is also over $1300.

I also can't say enough good things about my second L-series lens, Canon's EF 70-200mm F2.8/L IS USM. It may be big and bulky, but I almost always end up bringing it with me wherever I go because its fast, has great quality at all focal lengths, and has image stabilization. This lens is even more expensive (my coworker just bought the EF 70-200mm F4.0L and seems thrilled with it...so it might be a good alternative if cost is an issue).

My next lens purchases will be primes...looking at a 50 and an 85.

 

[Hiroshima]

And, if you only can afford one L series lens, l highly recommend Canon's EF 16-35mm F2.8/L USM...this has been my workhorse lens since going digital and, with the crop factor on these DSLRs,

Nice lens, fast, but pricey. If the OP *NEEDS* a wide angle lens this would make a good choice. I personally would sacrafice some speed to spend less $$$ and get the 17-40 F4/L. The noise on the XT and the 20D is so low, you can push ISO400 to help make up for the difference in lens speed and still have smooth great pics.

IMO a 17-40 F4/L or a 24-70 F2.8/L has more bang for the buck money wise.

If you are shooting more indoors that out, where you need to capture a lot of physical space the 16-35 2.8 is probably a great choice. But if you are mostly outdoors you likely don't need as much speed and can save some cash.

All IMO, and my bias leans towards saving money at this point in my life. Not sure if the 16-35 is worth 2x the money of the 17-40.

 

[Ojas]

This a great discussion. I appreciate all the input from everyone.

Regarding prices and dealers: I got the prices from B&H Photo, J & R, Dell or BuyDig. The prices from Dell were after one or more coupon codes, which may be expired by now (but there should be other ones soon). All are Canon Authorized Dealers, so there will be no issue with the rebate.

If SLRs are anything like regular cameras, the reality is that I would upgrade the body within a few years, anyway. The Rebel looks like the way to go for me.

Instead of adding useless items to that package just to get a discount...

My other advice is to pick up the cheaper printer that is also on the rebate and give it as an X-Mas Gift. That way you can tripple rebate your other items and give a nice gift for a nice price.

This is exactly the kind of advice I’m looking for since, without having experience with lenses, I did not know if I should buy Canon or if I would be better off skipping the rebates and go with something else. Thanks.

I havent really used any Canon's ever... I'm a tad sick of hearing about Canon.

If someone who has used both can provide solid, specific reasons (like features, usability, camera quality, quality/availability of accessories, etc.) to go with Nikon, I would definitely consider it. However, I need something more concrete than "It’s what I’ve always used" or "everyone I know uses it".

he may shoot me for saying this in public, but i'd ask rob and give **serious** consideration to his thoughts

I have not asked him, but I have read the advice he and others gave to folks like myself (here, for example). Of course, the photography RSO 34 and others keep posting on this site one of the reasons I started thinking about SLR in the first place.

Hiroshima and arika3d, I did not realize I could squeeze an L lens into the budget I threw out. So, I suppose it’s better to invest in an L lens without IS than a regular one with IS. This is much more interesting now. I expect only a small minority of the shots to be indoors, so I am thinking I could get by with 17-40 f/4L.

Rather than going with this for about $1320 (after $200 rebate)...

• Rebel XT kit
• 18-55 f/3.5-5.6 (included in kit)
• 70-200 f/4L
• 50 f/1.8 II

... perhaps I should do this for about $1725 (after $345 rebate):

• Rebel XT body
• 70-200 f/4L
• 17-40 f/4L
• 50 f/1.8 II

Any additional thoughts? Much thanks.

 

[Hiroshima]

Hiroshima and arika3d, I did not realize I could squeeze an L lens into the budget I threw out. So, I suppose it’s better to invest in an L lens without IS than a regular one with IS. This is much more interesting now. I expect only a small minority of the shots to be indoors, so I am thinking I could get by with 17-40 f/4L.

IMHO I think L glass is definately worth the money for a multitude of reasons:
1. It requires less post processing to look good. Notice I did not say it requires NO post processing.
2. They are a lot sharper w/o applying sharpening via software. Nice feature to have
3. They have a higher resale value if you decide that the lens you bought is not right for you.
4. They generally have better color and higher color saturation. I find that when I shoot with an L lens, when I Photoshop the picture and try to *ADD* saturation not much happens. The pictures seem to look good on their own w/o a lot of extra fiddling (remember I am still very ameture with PS and photography in general)

IS is nice (have used it on a friend's lens) and it can help with low light conditions and when using a long lens. I personally would rather have L glass over Non-L glass w/ IS for the reasons listed above.

As far as Nikon vs Canon:
The only advice I can give here is to look on dpreview.com and look at their REbel XT review. They give comparisons to the equivilant Nikon. With the Rebel XT's new shot buffer the gap between the Nikon, the D20, and the XT got a lot smaller. The old Rebel took almost 3 seconds to turn on and had a 4 shot buffer (2.5 Frames per second). The new xt has a 14 shot buffer with a 3 FPS shoot rate. But since it has DIGIC II it can finally take advantage of a fast card (like the Sandisk Ultra II & III) I have squeezed off 25+ shots and the XT did not blink or slow a bit. (Using a Ultra II card). I REALLY like the continuous shooting on the XT over the old model.

Also, if you have not found

http://www.fredmiranda.com/reviews/

check them out. They have real world reviews, by real people, of all the lenses you have listed here.

LMK if you have any other questions.

Cheers.... Isn't this FUN?!!!:wink:

 

[NeoNSX]

If you want to take photos as good as <B>Akira3D</B>, buy L series lenses. It's that simple.


Sink your money into the best lens you can get because that's where the quality comes from. An expensive body with a cheap lens = cheap quality photos.

I echo Eric's recommendations to buy L series lens. They are a sound longterm investment -- you pay now, but you won't be thinking of the cost later when you're looking at those fantastic photos.

Here is one example photo by Eric that i think shows off the L Series lenses: a simple, nothing-special photo with varying contrasts... but it just looks fantastic.


(for some reason i cant link IMG tags... but i'm referring to the last photo of this post)
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showpost.php?p=526554&postcount=90

 

[RSO 34]

he may shoot me for saying this in public, but i'd ask rob and give **serious** consideration to his thoughts:
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61466

I don't know why you would think I would "shoot you" because I am flattered that anyone would think enough of my "work" to consider my opinions.

As mentioned in the thread linked above, I shoot Canons and rely upon L series lenses for that extra "oomph". You do get what you pay for and simply put, better quality glass on an "inferior" camera will generate better quality photos than inferior glass on a superior body.

The Rebel body may not be as "sturdy" as the 20D but the "heart" of the camera is essentially the same. Invest in the glass and, especially, the IS lenses because you will be amazed at the handheld shots you are able to get. All of the shots I post here, whether track photography or nature shots, are handheld and done with IS lenses. The only time I use a tripod will be for "self-portraits" or other situations where I want to get into the photo and do not trust anyone else to try to compose the shot.