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clutch job = realignment?
- Thread starter anvil
- Start date
If the guy who disassembled the rear suspension, to get the trans out, did not mark the camber settings then, YES!!
It is also not a bad idea after such a job, since the car is in the shop anyway, to have it done.(just trying to make lemonade out of lemons
)
I just paid $65 for a FULL four wheel alignment (1 hour labor) don't let them tell you it's a big job, because it is actually relatively easy on the NSX.
HTH,
LarryB
It is also not a bad idea after such a job, since the car is in the shop anyway, to have it done.(just trying to make lemonade out of lemons
I just paid $65 for a FULL four wheel alignment (1 hour labor) don't let them tell you it's a big job, because it is actually relatively easy on the NSX.
HTH,
LarryB
Larry,
Thanks for the response! I realized this weekend that the driver's side rear wheel was lined up with a point about 6 to 8 inches out from the front wheel and knew a fix was in order. Could the camber adjustment change the tow that much or is there a spacer or something that could have been left out?
I don't know if it is the clutch shop I need to see or the alignment shop?
anvil
Thanks for the response! I realized this weekend that the driver's side rear wheel was lined up with a point about 6 to 8 inches out from the front wheel and knew a fix was in order. Could the camber adjustment change the tow that much or is there a spacer or something that could have been left out?
I don't know if it is the clutch shop I need to see or the alignment shop?
anvil
anvil,
6-8" out!! You need to explain this in a little more detail. I obviously do not understand exactly what you mean since 6-8" offset, or camber/toe is not really assembled correctly.
Please hold that thought, since I am sure I do not understand what you mean. To be sure the camber and toe setting will interact. So if you change one you will change the other.
Assuming we are talking about the rear suspension, to do a clutch job you must remove the toe link (preferably at the rear beam end, which will require no adjustment to reassemble) and you will remove the two bolts that mount the lower A-arm to the subframe. The rearmost of these two bolts, on the lower A-arm, sets the camber for that wheel. Typically you would mark the position of the camber setting before taking it apart and just return it to where it was and all is well.
If not you just need it aligned.
Please explain further your 6-8" comment, how do both sides of the car compare to each other??
I am not sure how it could be assembled wrong, but it also depends on how it was taken apart.
Fill me in.
HTH,
LarryB
[This message has been edited by Larry Bastanza (edited 11 September 2002).]
6-8" out!! You need to explain this in a little more detail. I obviously do not understand exactly what you mean since 6-8" offset, or camber/toe is not really assembled correctly.
Please hold that thought, since I am sure I do not understand what you mean. To be sure the camber and toe setting will interact. So if you change one you will change the other.
Assuming we are talking about the rear suspension, to do a clutch job you must remove the toe link (preferably at the rear beam end, which will require no adjustment to reassemble) and you will remove the two bolts that mount the lower A-arm to the subframe. The rearmost of these two bolts, on the lower A-arm, sets the camber for that wheel. Typically you would mark the position of the camber setting before taking it apart and just return it to where it was and all is well.
If not you just need it aligned.
Please explain further your 6-8" comment, how do both sides of the car compare to each other??
I am not sure how it could be assembled wrong, but it also depends on how it was taken apart.
Fill me in.
HTH,
LarryB
[This message has been edited by Larry Bastanza (edited 11 September 2002).]
Larry,
That was an exaggeration I discovered when I rechecked with a ruler the next morning in the daylight. If you sighted along the tire (imagine a long stick laying across the sides of the rear tire) the stick would point at a point on a ruler laying on the ground next to and perpendicular to the front tire. The point on the ruler that it was pointed at was NOT 6-8 inches as I thought, but 4 inches.
Sorry for the error.
Gosh, I was so freaked when I first noticed it I thought it was a foot!
Took it back to the shop that had replaced the clutch yesterday. Seems that the guy had lined up the wrong two marks on one of the eccentrics that position the wheel. He said he had it 80 to 90 degrees off. I was surprised that there was that much of an adjustment range. The tire was obviously towed out even standing above it looking down. I must have been blind to miss it in the first place, ... I just wanted to get back on the road too much!
All's well, however. Just lost a little rear tire rubber, ... but hey, it is an nsx!
anvil
That was an exaggeration I discovered when I rechecked with a ruler the next morning in the daylight. If you sighted along the tire (imagine a long stick laying across the sides of the rear tire) the stick would point at a point on a ruler laying on the ground next to and perpendicular to the front tire. The point on the ruler that it was pointed at was NOT 6-8 inches as I thought, but 4 inches.
Sorry for the error.
Gosh, I was so freaked when I first noticed it I thought it was a foot!
Took it back to the shop that had replaced the clutch yesterday. Seems that the guy had lined up the wrong two marks on one of the eccentrics that position the wheel. He said he had it 80 to 90 degrees off. I was surprised that there was that much of an adjustment range. The tire was obviously towed out even standing above it looking down. I must have been blind to miss it in the first place, ... I just wanted to get back on the road too much!
All's well, however. Just lost a little rear tire rubber, ... but hey, it is an nsx!
anvil
anvil,
Great, glad it is aligned correctly. There is quite a bit of adjustment. The problem usually comes in when the car is too low and th adjustment is out of range (can't get enough positive camber).
By your comment I have another thing I want to mention:
You said the toe was out by looking down? Did you mean the camber? Toe is wheels in and out front to back like:
Front of car
/ \ toe in, or \ / toe out
Rear of car
The eccentric that was adjusted is for camber which is the wheel in/out at the top of the wheel vs. the bottom:
Negative Camber:
Top of tire LEFT SIDE
/
Bottom of tire
Positive Camber:
Top of tire LEFT SIDE
\
Bottom of tire
I hope that makes sense
LarryB
[This message has been edited by Larry Bastanza (edited 11 September 2002).]
Great, glad it is aligned correctly. There is quite a bit of adjustment. The problem usually comes in when the car is too low and th adjustment is out of range (can't get enough positive camber).
By your comment I have another thing I want to mention:
You said the toe was out by looking down? Did you mean the camber? Toe is wheels in and out front to back like:
Front of car
/ \ toe in, or \ / toe out
Rear of car
The eccentric that was adjusted is for camber which is the wheel in/out at the top of the wheel vs. the bottom:
Negative Camber:
Top of tire LEFT SIDE
/
Bottom of tire
Positive Camber:
Top of tire LEFT SIDE
\
Bottom of tire
I hope that makes sense
LarryB
[This message has been edited by Larry Bastanza (edited 11 September 2002).]
Larry,
Yes, it does make sense. What my comment was intended to convey was that it was towed out so much that standing directly above the tire, the tow out was obvious, ... like the rear wheel was the front wheel when turning to the left a little. (There was obvious negative camber too, but that I expected.)
Of course it may still need alignment, but I had visions of something much more serious. I just thought anything I could see that easily had to be catastropic.
Wrong again, thank goodness!
anvil
Yes, it does make sense. What my comment was intended to convey was that it was towed out so much that standing directly above the tire, the tow out was obvious, ... like the rear wheel was the front wheel when turning to the left a little. (There was obvious negative camber too, but that I expected.)
Of course it may still need alignment, but I had visions of something much more serious. I just thought anything I could see that easily had to be catastropic.
Wrong again, thank goodness!
anvil
Sounds like we are in sync. If you look at the suspension goemetry you will see that as you adjust the camber more positive you will also get more toe in.
The camber adjustment is adjusting to lower A-arm position (the effective length), the toe link is almost in parallel with the lower A-arm, so as you shorten the lower A-arm effective length (adjust for more positive camber), you increase the effective length of the toe link. Result is more toe in.
It really sounds like you should have an alignment done, to be sure. It would be cheap compared to burning through a set of rear tires quickly.
HTH,
LarryB
[This message has been edited by Larry Bastanza (edited 12 September 2002).]
The camber adjustment is adjusting to lower A-arm position (the effective length), the toe link is almost in parallel with the lower A-arm, so as you shorten the lower A-arm effective length (adjust for more positive camber), you increase the effective length of the toe link. Result is more toe in.
It really sounds like you should have an alignment done, to be sure. It would be cheap compared to burning through a set of rear tires quickly.
HTH,
LarryB
[This message has been edited by Larry Bastanza (edited 12 September 2002).]
I had a clutch put in not too long ago and I had the same problem with the alignment being out. It was done at the dealership but how should i approach it with them? is it prob. that they will cover it?
If your car went in aligned it should come out that way. The fact is there should be no labor cost involved, if the tech marked the alignment setting before disassembly.
It is in the 1991 service manual, page 13-8 step #22.
On page 13-49, Step #14 it describes the reassembly. There is a "Caution" note about aligning the reference marks for reassembly.
If they hassle you about it, print the two pages and bring it to them!!
HTH,
LarryB
It is in the 1991 service manual, page 13-8 step #22.
On page 13-49, Step #14 it describes the reassembly. There is a "Caution" note about aligning the reference marks for reassembly.
If they hassle you about it, print the two pages and bring it to them!!
HTH,
LarryB
