New Edmunds Article

[Garys 1991 NSX]

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=129976

 

[H-carWizKid]

Everything is better with pics...

Not bad IMO

Not an NSX, but not bad.

P

 

[WingZ]

Aww man I wanted to be the first to post on this one

Oh well here's the meat for all the haters that will invariably post.

Honda goes for the hat trick:biggrin:

Our insider explains that Honda has employed as much F1 design as possible to generate maximum downforce and straight-line stability. That is why the NSX replacement was able to turn up at the Nürburgring and rattle off a red-hot lap time of 7 minutes, 37 seconds on its first attempt, and without any cumbersome rear wings. Our source predicts that when Honda returns to the 'Ring for the autumn testing season, it will almost certainly post a time under 7:30, giving the GT-R a real run for its money.

In contrast to Nissan and Lexus, which have used heavy rear transaxles in their GT-R and LF-A supercars to deliver equal front-rear weight distribution, Honda's trick for generating stability and downforce is pure aerodynamics. The Acura supercar will tip the scales at around 3,256 pounds, more than 550 pounds lighter than the GT-R. A quick look at the camouflaged test mule reveals extra-heavy padding around the C-pillar, which our insider hints is hiding F1-inspired design.

The secret: The whole rear section of the coupe is like one big rear wing.

Fitted with a 5.5-liter V10 generating upwards of 600 horsepower and 433 pound-feet of torque, the future Acura produces a thrilling exhaust note. And when speed is not the issue, the V10 deactivates five cylinders to save fuel and lower emissions. The V10 is bolted to a quick-shifting six-speed dual-clutch transmission driving the rear wheels, while a revised version of Honda's Super Handling AWD system generates the car's prodigious grip levels, enabling such a quick 'Ring lap time.

What this means to you: Aiming to be faster than the GT-R and ZR1 and yet delivering more luxury and a better ride than the LF-A, Honda is working hard to pull off a double-whammy. — Peter Lyons, Correspondent

 

[Crazy Acura]

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/supercars/spy-shots-2011-honda-acura-nsx/

Update: 600HP V10 and $160,000 Price Tag Rxpected for Acura’s NSX replacement
Posted on Tuesday 29 July 2008

Updated: Acura’s replacement for the NSX is still more than two years away but a number of key details about the car have been revealed by an inside source at Honda. According to the insider, the styling of the new car will be very similar to the Advanced Sports Car Concept from last year’s Detroit Auto Show and its future price tag will be around the $160,000 mark.

The car’s lines will favor efficiency over style, with much of the design derived from Honda’s F1 program. According to Edmunds, a prototype set a blistering Nurburgring lap time of 7m 37s on its first attempt and the final number should easily slip below 7m 30s and into Corvette ZR1 and Nissan GT-R territory.

The key to its performance is high-speed stability. The rear section of the car supposedly acts as a giant rear diffuser, designed to keep the 1,476kg (3,256lb) supercar glued to the road. The other factor in the performance equation is the car’s 5.5L V10 engine, which the insider revealed would output upwards of 600hp (450kW) and 433lb-ft (586Nm) of torque. When not at its peak, the engine will be able to deactivate half of its cylinders to save fuel and lower emissions. Drive will be sent to an uprated Super-Handling AWD system via a new six-speed dual-clutch transmission.

Original: Our spy photographers have been busy tracking the new Honda NSX prototype at Germany’s Nurburgring test track and have managed to hand time the car with some stunning results. In this early phase of testing the new NSX is already doing lap times of 7:38m, not far off some of the best official times ever recorded at the circuit. The time was achieved with some traffic on the circuit, but it’s not possible to judge how it affected the run.

The photographers also managed to get a shot of the interior. There’s not much to see, but one thing is certain, this car is being operated with paddle shifters located behind the steering wheel. With an expected 2010-2011 release date, the new NSX is therefore likely to be powered by a dual-clutch gearbox.

Original: Honda’s NSX replacement has had several false starts, with the company scrapping one of its original designs – the Acura Advanced Sports Car Concept - after the public’s largely negative response to the 2007 Detroit show car. Designers were sent back to the drawing board and Honda was forced to abandon its original plans to show the car at the following Tokyo Motor Show.

Despite the drawbacks, engineers were able to continue testing the new mechanicals for the car by using a modified S2000 body and we saw the first test-mules running laps at the Nurburgring by the middle of last year. The latest round of spy shots suggest Honda has come up with a final design for the car, as seen by this latest prototype once again spotted at the Nurburgring in Germany that’s very likely to be the replacement for the legendary Honda supercar.

Speaking with MotorAuthority back in April, Acura spokesman Mike Spencer confirmed several details of the upcoming NSX replacement. The car will definitely be powered by a V10 engine, and it will be equipped with the company’s SH-AWD system. The lack of intakes at the rear of the car also confirms the NSX replacement will feature a front-engine configuration, as opposed to the mid-engine layout of the former.

There has been some discussion of a possible four-wheel steering system (4WS) for the NSX replacement, but Spencer suggested the SH-AWD system would achieve most of the benefits of 4WS without the added complexity.

The NSX replacement is now expected to arrive sometime in 2010 as a 2011 model with final pricing expected to be revealed closer to the car’s release date.

$160k?

 

[WingZ]

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/supercars/spy-shots-2011-honda-acura-nsx/




$160k?

Hey Lexus will be $200k. This car will be taking out GT-R Spec V , every Ferrari , Vette and Porsche. We won't hear anymore under powered Honda BS flat out!

 

[Silver F16]

I wouldn't believe everything you read about the price tag of either the Lexus or the Acura.

 

[Juice]

If the whole rear is a wing, then does that mean that the rear glass wraps inside of the C-pillar, a la 599 GTB Fiorano??

 

[Ponyboy]

The rear of that concept above is gorgeous...the front meh. The article notes that function trumps style but it'd be nice if the Acura designers put a little effort in this area (I'm sure they will).

Really looking forward to this car. Realllly...

 

[WingZ]

I wouldn't believe everything you read about the price tag of either the Lexus or the Acura.

I keep thinking this as well Silver just don't see it that high and I really get the feeling this car will be closer to the GT-R in price.

 

[Crazy Acura]

I keep thinking this as well Silver just don't see it that high and I really get the feeling this car will be closer to the GT-R in price.

Doubt it. Most of these articles get at least somewhat close when they list estimated pricing.

If they say $160k then assume its at least between 120k-150k.

 

[Bear Report]

What's going on with the headlights in that rendering? They are awfully distracting.

I love the rear and hopefully the final car looks very similar to that. The front end... meh.

 

[amgnsx]

Everything is better with pics...

Not bad IMO

Not an NSX, but not bad.

P

i hope they dont use those wheels
looks like it came from a GT-R

 

[pegi]

I could take that anyday to my carage .
Intresting...

 

[NSXBat]

Well ...my wife has a 06 Civic SI that she just loves!

I'm not sure how I'd explain the $140,000 price difference for a car that looks like the Civic's big brother? Honda sure didn't take much risk with their design. Kind-of stayed close to home for this work of art LOL

I seem to remember a bigger design difference between the entry car and the Halo car back in 1991. So what happened to the gap? Entry Level cars got way better, or Halo cars got less exotic?

 

[BD]

Guys, it is a rendering photo!!!

But this should get every one excited if it is true.

The key to its performance is high-speed stability. The rear section of the car supposedly acts as a giant rear diffuser, designed to keep the 1,476kg (3,256lb) supercar glued to the road. The other factor in the performance equation is the car’s 5.5L V10 engine, which the insider revealed would output upwards of 600hp (450kW) and 433lb-ft (586Nm) of torque.

 

[nsxotic911]

I doubt the car will be as fast/powerful/light and at such a high price tag.
The rumors around the origional S2000 were that it would be a inline with 280+ hp in the 2700 lbs for like 40k. I wish it were b/c I would have paid for it.

I'll be impressed if they get 500 HP and 3400+ lbs. 32xxx lbs? Are you kidding me, the 02+ NSX-Ts came in at nearly 3200 lbs! And this is with alluminum chasis, V6 and all that fancy ligher parts stuff.

Bigger and wider car, bigger engine, bigger brakes, bigger wheels, bigger pen.. just means more weight, period.

 

[N Spec]

I doubt the car will be as fast/powerful/light and at such a high price tag.
The rumors around the origional S2000 were that it would be a inline with 280+ hp in the 2700 lbs for like 40k. I wish it were b/c I would have paid for it.

I'll be impressed if they get 500 HP and 3400+ lbs. 32xxx lbs? Are you kidding me, the 02+ NSX-Ts came in at nearly 3200 lbs! And this is with alluminum chasis, V6 and all that fancy ligher parts stuff.

Bigger and wider car, bigger engine, bigger brakes, bigger wheels, bigger pen.. just means more weight, period.

I agree, it will have to weigh more than the projected 3250 lbs. The car is no doubt bigger and has more of everything. The interior will be more luxurious, and the engine with AWD is only going to weigh it down even more. I can see them offering a type R style version where all of the luxuries are discarded to drop some 200 lbs or so and then weighing in at 3200ish lbs. The Rx7 didn't have a fancy material treatment, it just has a smaller engine, decently smaller dimensions (shorter overall length and width) and a lesser interior and it still beat the NSX out by 300lb or so. Realistically speaking, this new GT will be a pig in terms of size and weight, very close to the GTR. Hell the styling is not that much better, and the price tag is already twice as much.

I think it will tip the scales at 3500 lbs at least. I can believe the engine will make some 550-600 hp though, that's not a stretch. I just hope the cylinder deactivation does not end up being a dud and complicates things along the terms of reliability down the road. The more complex these things get, the easier it is for things to go wrong. Also no simple 6 speed manual transmission? WTH?

I think I will have to look at Lotus for the future lightweight exotic. They're using the new Camry engine as a base in the new Evora, something like a 2+2 NSX. Toyota is just as reliable as Honda. It weighs as much as an NA1, aluminum chasis, has the same power, more torque, MT, true mid-engine, 2 extra seats that displaces the trunk cargo and looks pretty good. Sounds like an excellent DD to me. This is the closer spiritual sucessor to the NSX, not some damn pigged out Audi. It's only a matter of time before this is supercharged or turbo for even more power and soon the new Espirit drops (perhaps a purer succesor to the NSX legacy) and such.

 

[MvM]

If the whole rear is a wing, then does that mean that the rear glass wraps inside of the C-pillar, a la 599 GTB Fiorano??

Does no one remember than even in our own beloved NSX the engine line in combination with trunk lid already acts like a kind of rear wing.
It smoothes out the airflow over the car and reduces turbulence.

Haven't you ever noticed that the engine lid and trunk lid never seem to get really dirty even if you are driving in the rain? Now you know why.

 

[jordansx]

Sweet, the Accord V10!

 

[WingZ]

Well ...my wife has a 06 Civic SI that she just loves!

I'm not sure how I'd explain the $140,000 price difference for a car that looks like the Civic's big brother? Honda sure didn't take much risk with their design. Kind-of stayed close to home for this work of art LOL

I seem to remember a bigger design difference between the entry car and the Halo car back in 1991. So what happened to the gap? Entry Level cars got way better, or Halo cars got less exotic?

I guess your memory is off as you couldn't even find pics of close to the same year. Of course it seems you do stuff like that deliberately.

How about same year same angle same color on the NSX and Civic CRX

The Family resemblance is there on one of their cheaper cars so apparently they always stayed close to home.

I doubt the car will be as fast/powerful/light and at such a high price tag.
The rumors around the origional S2000 were that it would be a inline with 280+ hp in the 2700 lbs for like 40k. I wish it were b/c I would have paid for it.

I'll be impressed if they get 500 HP and 3400+ lbs. 32xxx lbs? Are you kidding me, the 02+ NSX-Ts came in at nearly 3200 lbs! And this is with alluminum chasis, V6 and all that fancy ligher parts stuff.

Bigger and wider car, bigger engine, bigger brakes, bigger wheels, bigger pen.. just means more weight, period.

So the S2K came in at 240 hp and weighed a little under 2700 LBS for $31K and that was a deal killer

Hmm your comparing weight savings of a car designed in the 80's which was pretty light for it's day to one being designed 20 years later. If aftermarket people are now able to get us weight saving parts for our cars why couldn't Honda do this on their car since they have a competition goal to beat.

I agree, it will have to weigh more than the projected 3250 lbs. The car is no doubt bigger and has more of everything. The interior will be more luxurious, and the engine with AWD is only going to weigh it down even more. I can see them offering a type R style version where all of the luxuries are discarded to drop some 200 lbs or so and then weighing in at 3200ish lbs. The Rx7 didn't have a fancy material treatment, it just has a smaller engine, decently smaller dimensions (shorter overall length and width) and a lesser interior and it still beat the NSX out by 300lb or so. Realistically speaking, this new GT will be a pig in terms of size and weight, very close to the GTR. Hell the styling is not that much better, and the price tag is already twice as much.

I think it will tip the scales at 3500 lbs at least. I can believe the engine will make some 550-600 hp though, that's not a stretch. I just hope the cylinder deactivation does not end up being a dud and complicates things along the terms of reliability down the road. The more complex these things get, the easier it is for things to go wrong. Also no simple 6 speed manual transmission? WTH?

I think I will have to look at Lotus for the future lightweight exotic. They're using the new Camry engine as a base in the new Evora, something like a 2+2 NSX. Toyota is just as reliable as Honda. It weighs as much as an NA1, aluminum chasis, has the same power, more torque, MT, true mid-engine, 2 extra seats that displaces the trunk cargo and looks pretty good. Sounds like an excellent DD to me. This is the closer spiritual sucessor to the NSX, not some damn pigged out Audi. It's only a matter of time before this is supercharged or turbo for even more power and soon the new Espirit drops (perhaps a purer succesor to the NSX legacy) and such.

Well if GM can do it why can't Honda? The Vette is able to offer a big engine lighter weight sportscar at a certain price point. If GM new people would pay for it they could make the Vette lighter with newer materials that are available it would just cost a lot more for these more exotic materials. Honda really did this same kind of thought process back with the original NSX why do you guys think it's such a big deal now??

Also if they can't make a reliable car with a Celica engine you think it would be any better with a Camry engine. Plus $200k for a Camry engined car even if it is behind the seats is um ... let's just say in this case I doubt you get what you pay for.

 

[N Spec]

Well if GM can do it why can't Honda? The Vette is able to offer a big engine lighter weight sportscar at a certain price point. If GM new people would pay for it they could make the Vette lighter with newer materials that are available it would just cost a lot more for these more exotic materials. Honda really did this same kind of thought process back with the original NSX why do you guys think it's such a big deal now??

Also if they can't make a reliable car with a Celica engine you think it would be any better with a Camry engine. Plus $200k for a Camry engined car even if it is behind the seats is um ... let's just say in this case I doubt you get what you pay for.

Are you saying that the new prototype is the same size as the Vette? I don't think so. The vette has a always been a small car and the NSX is smaller than the new vette. With this said, the new GT is much larger than both. The Corvette has a lightweight V8, no AWD, more fiberglass body panels and the interior is not exactly luxurious. GM pulled this off by offering a car that is minimal. This new GT is the exact opposite, it is bigger and more luxurious than the vette. It's size is closer to that of the Astons and GTR, which mean around 3800+ lbs. I'm sure Honda can shave off 200-300lbs compared to the competition that are the around the same size and so weighing in at around 3500 lbs, they could say it is lightweight, even though it is not essentially. I'm not saying it's impossible to to weigh 3200lbs, but judging from it's size, unless the prototype will undergo a substantial change in size and shape, the thing will be a pig.

What is wrong with a Toyota engine? We drive cars with Honda engines. Rumors say the Evora actually is going to be priced at £45,000, which is tapping at $90,000 USD currently. I have heard the Elise are quite reliable (better than the average car), the only stigma of course is paying so much for a 4 cylinder, not a Toyota engine. The new Esprit is supposed to have a BMW V8, so does that change anything? Doesn't for me, as long as the engine is proven to be reliable.

BTW, the CRX looks nothing like the NSX in shape or detail. You took two black cars said they look alike. You can take a black 240sx and a black Camaro and say they look alike, but in reality, look nothing alike. The Accord with similar tail lights would have been a better comparison. :smile:

 

[WingZ]

Are you saying that the new prototype is the same size as the Vette? I don't think so. The vette has a always been a small car and the NSX is smaller than the new vette. With this said, the new GT is much larger than both. The Corvette has a lightweight V8, no AWD, more fiberglass body panels and the interior is not exactly luxurious. GM pulled this off by offering a car that is minimal. This new GT is the exact opposite, it is bigger and more luxurious than the vette. It's size is closer to that of the Astons and GTR, which mean around 3800+ lbs. I'm sure Honda can shave off 200-300lbs compared to the competition that are the around the same size and so weighing in at around 3500 lbs, they could say it is lightweight, even though it is not essentially. I'm not saying it's impossible to to weigh 3200lbs, but judging from it's size, unless the prototype will undergo a substantial change in size and shape, the thing will be a pig.

No what I'm stating is that if GM can keep the Vette close to 3000 ( well closer than others ) we can at least give Honda the benefit of the doubt. I mean why shoot for that weight after you've got a prototype out? I'm sure they new what there were putting in it to start. Also perhaps that's the reason for the high price in as such it's using expensive exotic materials. Of course the NSX is a pig as well. Pretty much anything above 3000 lbs is though IMHO.

What is wrong with a Toyota engine? We drive cars with Honda engines. Rumors say the Evora actually is going to be priced at £45,000, which is tapping at $90,000 USD currently. I have heard the Elise are quite reliable (better than the average car), the only stigma of course is paying so much for a 4 cylinder, not a Toyota engine. The new Esprit is supposed to have a BMW V8, so does that change anything? Doesn't for me, as long as the engine is proven to be reliable.

I don't think anything is wrong with a Toyota engine in a Toyota. Kinda makes it a kit car of sorts. A reliable new engine from BMW? That's kind've an oxy moron.

BTW, the CRX looks nothing like the NSX in shape or detail. You took two black cars said they look alike. You can take a black 240sx and a black Camaro and say they look alike, but in reality, look nothing alike. The Accord with similar tail lights would have been a better comparison. :smile:

The detail is in the light bar the similarity is unmistakable. Didn't say they were twins but though. The NSX when it came out was called derivative in styling quite a bit. It's what the Japanese are known for in their cars. Also the Legend coupe is actually a better match than the Accord but hey Tomato Tomato:biggrin:

 

[N Spec]

No what I'm stating is that if GM can keep the Vette close to 3000 ( well closer than others ) we can at least give Honda the benefit of the doubt. I mean why shoot for that weight after you've got a prototype out? I'm sure they new what there were putting in it to start. Also perhaps that's the reason for the high price in as such it's using expensive exotic materials. Of course the NSX is a pig as well. Pretty much anything above 3000 lbs is though IMHO.




I don't think anything is wrong with a Toyota engine in a Toyota. Kinda makes it a kit car of sorts. A reliable new engine from BMW? That's kind've an oxy moron.



The detail is in the light bar the similarity is unmistakable. Didn't say they were twins but though. The NSX when it came out was called derivative in styling quite a bit. It's what the Japanese are known for in their cars. Also the Legend coupe is actually a better match than the Accord but hey Tomato Tomato:biggrin:

Well, we don't know what the final price is, but it can be assured that it will compete with Aston, the likes of that price range and weight class along with the obese styling cues. To say that the current NSX is a pig is not entirely accurate. Even the heaviest model is barely tapping on 3150 lbs. It's hard to find any car that is year 2000+ to weigh under 3400lbs, so the new pig category is 3500+lbs.

True, Lotus is something like a kit car, but kit cars don't offer factory warranty and support or mass produce the number of units as Lotus does. Their core competency is to build small, lightweight, efficient, while exotic, mid-engine and high performance vehicles. The new Evora is meant to be daily driven and can fit really tall adults all while still standing only 47 inches tall. I believe these are all of the traits that most people respond to when they see or own the NSX, not because it's a Honda engineered car. Honda has lost sight of that with the new GT and has moved on to pursue less inspiring dreams. Everyone can see this, even through the heavily camoed and obese zebra running the track. The shape and size just shouts I'm a big, heavy car, let alone the specs of a 5.5 liter v10 and AWD.

People buy Ferraris and Lambos because of the styling plus performance and now they have stepped up their reliability. The styling and mid-engines are what has always justified for most people the high price tag of these cars. The new GT offers neither of this while the current NSX does! Honda reliability in a very first complex V-10 that shuts off half of it's bank on the fly? Does not really sound reliable to me. I'm sure it will defeat the GTR and ZR1 by some couple of seconds on some track, but I honestly doubt the un-inspired styling will sell this 100K+ plus beast as well as Honda is banking on. They will have to rely on the cheaper RL sales.

 

[WingZ]

ROFLMAO N-Spec you are the Man! I love it "New pig category" LOL that is too funny!

I call my NSX a pig because it feels so much heaver than my S2K. I've gotten about 150 lbs off of it but still feels heavy in comparison. I'm not a big car guy . The ASCC when I saw it in person didn't seem too big so if this new car is of similar dimensions shouldn't be too bad. Still big of course but not to bad.

I also think the pricing will kill this car as status is what status is. First year will be sticker plus but second year I hope to get one at invoice. That's one of the greatest things about Hondas to me as I've never paid sticker for one. I hear people complaining about their price tags but those seem to be people who just look online. Inside the dealership is a different story.

Here's hoping people continue to diss this car and keep demand low:biggrin:

 

[BD]

I doubt the car will be as fast/powerful/light and at such a high price tag.
The rumors around the origional S2000 were that it would be a inline with 280+ hp in the 2700 lbs for like 40k. I wish it were b/c I would have paid for it.

I'll be impressed if they get 500 HP and 3400+ lbs. 32xxx lbs? Are you kidding me, the 02+ NSX-Ts came in at nearly 3200 lbs! And this is with alluminum chasis, V6 and all that fancy ligher parts stuff.

Bigger and wider car, bigger engine, bigger brakes, bigger wheels, bigger pen.. just means more weight, period.

Don't want to rain on your parade... BUT:biggrin:

GTR is 3800 lbs. The new Spec V is rumor to be 350lbs lighter, which make it 3450lbs. That car has some of the heaviest parts you can use on a car

I replaced the exhaust system on my NSX, it shed about 30 lbs, Type R seats, 30 lbs each side. That's already about 100 lbs.
The new Honda will be again aluminum frame, plus more likely CF and other exotic parts. The newer Honda engines are 20 to 30% lighter than the old, so this V10 will probably weight similar to the NSX V6, if not, just slightly more.

On paper, the preliminary rumor... This car is "only" 250 lbs heavier than the regular NSX, and 500 or so lbs heavier than NSX-R.

You guys have absolutely no faith with a company that is KNOWN to built light weight cars.

Honda is NOT MB or BMW, they DON'T stick big engines into their cars because they over build the chassis, they put big engines into cars because they want to make it go fast.