I just picked up a 2000 NSX and was wondering if the Timing Belt and Water Pump issue applies to this year?
If so, when should I look into replacing them?
Thanks!
If so, when should I look into replacing them?
Thanks!
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Timing Belt and Water Pump Issues by Year?
- Thread starter Rob4092xx
- Start date
What "issues" are you wondering about?
The timing belt replacement interval applies to all years. 7 years "OR" 90K miles whichever comes first. If your 2000 still has the original timing belt, get that replaced pronto unless you have lots of money for a new engine.
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Not true! I have no issue putting $1,500.00 into this car considering the condition and price!
Should have asked this question BEFORE you picked up this 2000.
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Appropriate? Wow. And a new engine is WAY more than $1500.
I though it was 6yr/60K miles for the TB/WP maintenace ... ... take it from me dont wait that long the money you think your saving is better spent in early maintenace.
... take it from me dont wait that long the money you think your saving is better spent in early maintenace.
http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Maintenance/Timing_Belt
shows 6 years or 90K miles but I have also heard 7 years at the Acura dealer. Most of us like to play it safe and do it at 6 years(most don't put 90K miles on their car in 6 or even 7 years). A 2000 with original TB is overdue even if 7 years is the max.
shows 6 years or 90K miles but I have also heard 7 years at the Acura dealer. Most of us like to play it safe and do it at 6 years(most don't put 90K miles on their car in 6 or even 7 years). A 2000 with original TB is overdue even if 7 years is the max.
I am going to call SOS tomorrow for a quote.
Thanks to everyone who assisted me with this Post!
Thanks to everyone who assisted me with this Post!
Rob,
There are other items besides the TB/WP that should be checked/replaced as well if you don't (or even if you do) know the maintenance history.
A wealth of information here:
http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Schedule_(Maintenance)
Some of the more important ones would be transmission fluid, coolant, and air filter.
I tend to do mine on the time rather than mileage which is probably what 90% of folks do (or should be doing) here.
Hope this helps.
There are other items besides the TB/WP that should be checked/replaced as well if you don't (or even if you do) know the maintenance history.
A wealth of information here:
http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Schedule_(Maintenance)
Some of the more important ones would be transmission fluid, coolant, and air filter.
I tend to do mine on the time rather than mileage which is probably what 90% of folks do (or should be doing) here.
Hope this helps.
I know I risk getting flamed, but there is no known case of a timing belt falure on any NSX engine.
My car is one of the oldest NSXs out there.
A '91 VIN 000209.
Purchased in November of 1990. Nineteen years old next month.
Original timing belt humming along just fine.
My car is one of the oldest NSXs out there.
A '91 VIN 000209.
Purchased in November of 1990. Nineteen years old next month.
Original timing belt humming along just fine.
This has been discussed endlessly, and frankly, I do not have a lot to add to what has already been discussed. I do have, some questions and observations.
In my real life I have been a practicing aircraft mechanic. I believe there are those on Prime who also have this experience. I bring this up only to reference the NSX Maintenance Manual. This states, as I recall it, that the timing belt is a RECOMMENDED, emphasis added, procedure. Now in the airplane world, those maintenance actions which not complied with and which non compliance would potentially result in a catastrophic mishap, would be a REQUIRED, again emphasis added. procedure. Obviously, bouncing the valves off the tops of pistons due to breakage of the timing belt would most certainly, at least in my world, result in an event I would consider catastrophic.
My question is: If the timing belt time change limits were hard, why would the manufacturer only RECOMMEND, again emphasis added,
the change and not REQUIRE it? I don't have the answer.
The observation I have refers to my '92 Integra beater. I love this car, incidentally. I bought it with 124,000 miles on the clock, with generally complete maintenance records. No record of timing belt change, however. Not having a manual, I consulted with the all knowing message boards for my education. Most responses indicated an immediate cessation of operation and change of the TB/WP. I did this.
Inspection of the timing belt after removal, revealed what appeared to be an OEM part. Was it original? Can't tell. What I did see was a belt that on casual inspection could have been reinstalled. It APPEARED, emphasis added, that good. Now, I am aware of the internals of these belts allegedly being subject to some sort of chemical deterioration which would subject them to breakage due to aging. And this deterioration would not be apparent visually or by twisting the belt to listen for broken or brittle internals. Again, I have no idea and nobody that I know has been able to substantiate that claim. Is there any manufacturer information on this?
I have saved the TB from the old Integra and intend to subject it to a destructive test of its integrity at some point by stretching while somehow rigging it with strain gauges to measure the breaking tension. I realize this is totally unscientific, but it might be interesting to see what happens.
In the meantime, I continue to drive my stock '93 with the original TB. Yes, it only has 15K on it, but I treat it well. Vent the engine compartment allowing heat to escape after shutdowns, keep it in a climate controlled garage, frequent oil changes, and weekly inspections.
I have also wrapped the exhaust with heat insulation tape under the LR CV joint to mitigate the overheating and loss of grease.
My 2C.
In my real life I have been a practicing aircraft mechanic. I believe there are those on Prime who also have this experience. I bring this up only to reference the NSX Maintenance Manual. This states, as I recall it, that the timing belt is a RECOMMENDED, emphasis added, procedure. Now in the airplane world, those maintenance actions which not complied with and which non compliance would potentially result in a catastrophic mishap, would be a REQUIRED, again emphasis added. procedure. Obviously, bouncing the valves off the tops of pistons due to breakage of the timing belt would most certainly, at least in my world, result in an event I would consider catastrophic.
My question is: If the timing belt time change limits were hard, why would the manufacturer only RECOMMEND, again emphasis added,
the change and not REQUIRE it? I don't have the answer.
The observation I have refers to my '92 Integra beater. I love this car, incidentally. I bought it with 124,000 miles on the clock, with generally complete maintenance records. No record of timing belt change, however. Not having a manual, I consulted with the all knowing message boards for my education. Most responses indicated an immediate cessation of operation and change of the TB/WP. I did this.
Inspection of the timing belt after removal, revealed what appeared to be an OEM part. Was it original? Can't tell. What I did see was a belt that on casual inspection could have been reinstalled. It APPEARED, emphasis added, that good. Now, I am aware of the internals of these belts allegedly being subject to some sort of chemical deterioration which would subject them to breakage due to aging. And this deterioration would not be apparent visually or by twisting the belt to listen for broken or brittle internals. Again, I have no idea and nobody that I know has been able to substantiate that claim. Is there any manufacturer information on this?
I have saved the TB from the old Integra and intend to subject it to a destructive test of its integrity at some point by stretching while somehow rigging it with strain gauges to measure the breaking tension. I realize this is totally unscientific, but it might be interesting to see what happens.
In the meantime, I continue to drive my stock '93 with the original TB. Yes, it only has 15K on it, but I treat it well. Vent the engine compartment allowing heat to escape after shutdowns, keep it in a climate controlled garage, frequent oil changes, and weekly inspections.
I have also wrapped the exhaust with heat insulation tape under the LR CV joint to mitigate the overheating and loss of grease.
My 2C.
Correction to my previous post.
Please change LR cv joint to RR. That's where the problems lie.
Thanks
Please change LR cv joint to RR. That's where the problems lie.
Thanks
I just replaced the timing belt on my 94 with 45,000 kms. It appears to be the original belt (I had no records from the previous owners that indicated a replacement) and seems to be in good/fair condition. No crinkle when twisted. However when you lay the belt down on a flat surface it would take the shape of its path around the cams. I believe this was due to long periods of engine inactivity during storage. I believe that these permanent bends in the belt could possibly lead to a weak point and break at some time in the distant future.
In addition to replacing the belt and water pump I had the valves adjusted (3 exhaust were found to be too tight) and threw in a new set of plugs. There is a very noticeable improvement with engine performance. I don't know if changing the timing belt played any role in the increase in hp but I do have 'peace of mind' and don't hesitate to step on it now and again :wink:
In addition to replacing the belt and water pump I had the valves adjusted (3 exhaust were found to be too tight) and threw in a new set of plugs. There is a very noticeable improvement with engine performance. I don't know if changing the timing belt played any role in the increase in hp but I do have 'peace of mind' and don't hesitate to step on it now and again :wink:
While your statements may be correct they are likely due to the facts that:
1) There are simply not that many NSX's in existence relative to a normal production car, so your sample size is too small
2) The vast majority of owners change the TB/WP early enough that failure is still far off, so the owner population is far different than the "average" car owner whose cars are not nearly as well maintained
In Larry B's shop he has dozens of TB's of varying lengths all from TB/WP services he has performed. Many of these belts "look" okay, but do you really want a TB that is stretched 3" longer (maybe more IIRC) than when it was new running your engine?
Yep, you'll get flamed. Do you often make statements with certainty about things you can't possibly be certain of? Or did you mean to say that *you* don't know of any? A quick search will reveal at least a couple failures.
That is absolutely NOT true. I have personally heard of at least one TB failure and many more WP failures as has Pat Goss: http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showpost.php?p=70809&postcount=7
Call Jon Martin, SOS, Basch and I guarantee they've seen them as well.
I'll concede that many of these may be due to WP failure which in turn causes the TB failure but that's just another reason to perform the 90K service and replace the water pump which can and does fail.
All I can say is if your TB is 19 years old keep an eye out for replacement engines soon. Is your WP equally as old? Wow...just...wow.
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I often wonder which would save me money in the long run....preventative maintenance or repair.
I guess thats the real question, how much does it cost me to replace it now vs waiting for it to fail and replacing any additional damage the failure may have caused.
Big risks = big rewards....my TB/WP service was $1149.95 at the Acura Dealer. If it had been done at the Acura Suggested service interval (Service manual suggests 90K/72-months between intervals) it would have cost (3) x $1149.95 ($3449.85 over the life of the car).
Now....if it failed how much would the repair be?
My 1992 had 26K miles when I purchased it this year in February. Original TB/WP. 17 years old, it looked pretty good to be honest...its a quality belt. But.......if I didn't change it I would have felt like Clint Eastwood/Dirty Harry was asking me "Do you feel lucky, punk" each time I started the car.
I think its great you were able to get so much life out of your Timing Belt...let us know when it fails or when you decide to replace it. I'm curious to know how long they could really last.
I guess thats the real question, how much does it cost me to replace it now vs waiting for it to fail and replacing any additional damage the failure may have caused.
Big risks = big rewards....my TB/WP service was $1149.95 at the Acura Dealer. If it had been done at the Acura Suggested service interval (Service manual suggests 90K/72-months between intervals) it would have cost (3) x $1149.95 ($3449.85 over the life of the car).
Now....if it failed how much would the repair be?
My 1992 had 26K miles when I purchased it this year in February. Original TB/WP. 17 years old, it looked pretty good to be honest...its a quality belt. But.......if I didn't change it I would have felt like Clint Eastwood/Dirty Harry was asking me "Do you feel lucky, punk" each time I started the car.
I think its great you were able to get so much life out of your Timing Belt...let us know when it fails or when you decide to replace it. I'm curious to know how long they could really last.
Indeed. Matk Basch said here on Prime in 2005 that he had seen four broken NSX timing belts.
That is absolutely NOT true. I have personally heard of at least one TB failure and many more WP failures as has Pat Goss: http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showpost.php?p=70809&postcount=7
Call Jon Martin, SOS, Basch and I guarantee they've seen them as well.
I'll concede that many of these may be due to WP failure which in turn causes the TB failure but that's just another reason to perform the 90K service and replace the water pump which can and does fail.
All I can say is if your TB is 19 years old keep an eye out for replacement engines soon. Is your WP equally as old? Wow...just...wow.
+1
TB/WP Service = ~$1000
Broken Belt = $6000+
That's easy math. It doesn't make sense to me to not replace it.
Im only going to say this a few more times
There is absolutely NOTHING you can tell about the "quality" or "time left" of a timing belt simply by looking at it. So all you folks saying "it looked great to me!" are only fooling yourselves.
You have EVERY right to not perform maintenance on your vehicle. If you are going to keep it forever, more power to you.
There is absolutely NOTHING you can tell about the "quality" or "time left" of a timing belt simply by looking at it. So all you folks saying "it looked great to me!" are only fooling yourselves.
You have EVERY right to not perform maintenance on your vehicle. If you are going to keep it forever, more power to you.
One of the funniest lines - although perhaps not meant to be- was when I asked Eiffel, NSX mechanic in Atlanta, about this subject when someone had told me their mechanic had looked at their TB and said it "looked" good. Eiffle's comment to that was classic - "even the broken ones look good"! Priceless! I think that pretty much says it all.
Now do I think that a TB at the very moment it hits 90k or I thought 105k in the N2s or 7 years it's automaticaly going to explode - absolutely not - Honda wouldn't build anything like that - no manufacturer would design a belt to do that either. Everything is built with a safety factor - some areas are more prone to ozone issues and climate issues - this is a big world and all conditions are not the same so you have to look at issues as a whole for everything considered and work to the "lowest" common denominator on issues like TBs - so you come up with a "recommended" change rate/date/mileage. Does that mean that in Atlanta or south GA, things are going to go bad at the same rate they would in Alaska - no, or someother really drastically different climate like Dubai - 130 degrees, obviously not. But common sense says you do things systematically and on a recommended change rate per manufacturers written instructions - like every other industry does!
I'll tell you a little story - a belt on my bimmer broke - all kinds of things were bad because of that. Water pump - radiator - oh man it was bad- don't really want to think about it - point is if something breaks - like a TB - man you really don't want that to happen. So if I had a car with 18 years on a TB that hadn't been replaced and I'd been driving it - I would consider myself really super lucky that it hadn't broken and I'd get it replaced - like really soon- I sure wouldn't test it any further. But that's as they say up to YOU!
Consider Prime as the "voice of reason". :wink:
Now do I think that a TB at the very moment it hits 90k or I thought 105k in the N2s or 7 years it's automaticaly going to explode - absolutely not - Honda wouldn't build anything like that - no manufacturer would design a belt to do that either. Everything is built with a safety factor - some areas are more prone to ozone issues and climate issues - this is a big world and all conditions are not the same so you have to look at issues as a whole for everything considered and work to the "lowest" common denominator on issues like TBs - so you come up with a "recommended" change rate/date/mileage. Does that mean that in Atlanta or south GA, things are going to go bad at the same rate they would in Alaska - no, or someother really drastically different climate like Dubai - 130 degrees, obviously not. But common sense says you do things systematically and on a recommended change rate per manufacturers written instructions - like every other industry does!
I'll tell you a little story - a belt on my bimmer broke - all kinds of things were bad because of that. Water pump - radiator - oh man it was bad- don't really want to think about it - point is if something breaks - like a TB - man you really don't want that to happen. So if I had a car with 18 years on a TB that hadn't been replaced and I'd been driving it - I would consider myself really super lucky that it hadn't broken and I'd get it replaced - like really soon- I sure wouldn't test it any further. But that's as they say up to YOU!
Consider Prime as the "voice of reason". :wink:
Hey Guys don't discourage Scott and Champ they are providing us with valuable info ,some of my most valued findings came from testing components to their max,I love it !
whats the concensus on the 'aftermarket racing' TB that i saw somewhere on prime?
Ralph has a point.......Go Scott and Champ! :biggrin:
