Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community

[Cody@LoveFab]

We completed back to back test runs within hours of eachother and the new results are posted on page 2.



The community has struggled with the lack of forced induction header choices for the Acura NSX for years. Headers have always been built with natural aspiration in mind. Most of the available headers currently on the market follow a specific cookie cutter pattern that is virtually identical. This N/A design ultimately becomes a compromise at the higher power levels achieved when using a turbo, supercharger, or nitrous.

In early 2009 we decided that we could break the mold and offer a choice for those that want more power out of their NSX. We designed the first set of headers geared toward forced induction for the NSX and saw immediate results. Our design was tested on six different boosted NSXs and substantial gains were noticed across the powerband on all of them.

Earlier last year we decided to bolt our headers to a stock NSX to see exactly what kinds of gains were possible without the other variables that a forced induction system can introduce. We ran the first naturally aspirated test car on the local Mustang Dyno in May of 2009. The test vehicle is a 1994 Brooklands Green NSX that was completely stock with 155,000 miles on the odometer. The car in bone-stock configuration made 229 WHP and 173 WTQ with peak HP occurring at 7450 RPM.

We bolted our LoveFab headers to the car and then carefully fabricated a new prototype exhaust to compliment the new header design. The ’94 was strapped to the dyno again and we were astonished with the results: 274 WHP and 185 WTQ on the first run.

We had never heard of a header/exhaust combo producing gains of over 45 WHP so we scrambled for explanations. We checked and rechecked the dyno settings which were indeed at the same settings as in May. The air temps and local weather conditions were also nearly identical as they were in May. Upon closer comparison of the dyno runs, we realized the baseline dyno run showed power dropping off at 7450 RPM and the new setup made power all the way to 8200. Awesome!

Extremely happy with the results, we continued running the car to the 8200 RPM redline to test under heat-soaked conditions and still walked away with 275 WHP and 187 WTQ.

When the weather clears, we will have some great video to post!

We are offering this as a combination only. Each component is unique in sizing, collector length, and header termination points. The result is that neither component will fit on an NSX without the other. The benefit is the ultimate in performance with no compromise.

$3799 is retail for this wonderful combination. We are considering a group buy for the first 5 packages sold, so please let us know in this thread if you are interested.

We are also interested in providing a discounted package to anyone with a high HP supercharger setup (400+ WHP) with the capabilities to provide a before and after dyno graph, along with videos. Please PM or email us for details.

 

[clr1024]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Very impressive. Any pictures of the set-up? Interested in headers...but can't justify that money on the car right now:frown:

 

[LoveNSXs]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Noooo.

I just burned 2gs on an exhaust too....

sigh. You sure this header won't work with ANY other exhaust? maybe with some fabbing? =/

 

[clr1024]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

What kind of HP/Torque did the stock car make at 8200 RPM?

 

[Mac Attack]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Without seeing your header/exhaust, I'm guessing it's very short primaries that will shift the torque peak higher in the RPM range. That would be desirable when fabricating a nice turbo manifold too for reduced pipe volume, flow losses, and heat losses to the turbo.

Your dyno results would be expected then. Up until 6500 RPM's, the gains from your system are less than the traditional longer tube primaries seen with all other aftermarket headers. However, at 6500 RPM's, you will see much larger gains than the others.

This is also desirable on the racetrack where you're in a limited high RPM range and can sacrifice torque down low. Not necessarily the best for street driving....

From basic header theory, assuming stock camshafts and a power peak of 8000RPM, your primaries are less than 8 inches long.

Very impressive high-RPM gain though!

Dave

 

[WillErickson]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Very interested to see some numbers on a high boost CTSC car.

 

[NSXRguy]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

very interested to see some numbers on a high boost ctsc car.

+1

 

[Cody@LoveFab]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Mother nature isn’t playing very nice at the moment, but we will try to take some pics as soon as possible.

Unfortunately, these will only work as a pair of components as of right now. I will see what we can do to possibly make the headers properly adapt to other exhausts in the future.

I’ll find the older dyno graphs from when we pulled the stock car to the limiter. From memory, the bone-stock car made 219 – 220 HP at the rev limit. The new system makes approximately 55 WHP more than stock at max RPM.

We will offer a $1000 discount to the first supercharged customer who would like to do a nonbiased back-to-back dyno test and write-up. We will even work out a discounted enclosed transportation rate for this first one if you would like to ship the car.

Thanks guys!

 

[nsxinkl]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Any plans to make just the headers for turbo nsx?

 

[LoveNSXs]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Unfortunately, these will only work as a pair of components as of right now. I will see what we can do to possibly make the headers properly adapt to other exhausts in the future.
Thanks guys!

I can send you the exhaust I bought and maybe you guys can work with it? =D

 

[nathan]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

I am interested in seeing the results on one your standard 8psi bolt on turbo kits. If it shows these kinds of gains, then I am again curious as to what the package offer will be for those existing LoveFab Turbo Kit owners.

If the gains are substantial then, I am curious to see what will happen when you put on one of the AEM Meth kits on top of this header/exhaust combo.

Are you thinking about giving a credit towards current LoveFab owners? Just wondering because people cant sell the headers/exhaust that came with your turbo kit.

Good results, but I am anxious to see what the results are on your Stage 1 kit. Keep us updated.

Thanks

 

[Ko-nsx]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

I’ll find the older dyno graphs from when we pulled the stock car to the limiter. From memory, the bone-stock car made 219 – 220 HP at the rev limit. The new system makes approximately 55 WHP more than stock at max RPM.
Thanks guys!

Bone stock na1 or na2? How do these headers compare the na2 headers?

 

[LoveNSXs]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Bone stock na1 or na2? How do these headers compare the na2 headers?

I think the OP said a 94 Brooklands Green NSX.

so, NA1?

 

[Ko-nsx]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

I think the OP said a 94 Brooklands Green NSX.

so, NA1?

I see what year vehicle he ran the test on, im wondering if his header/exhaust combo is substantial over purchasing na2 headers for a na1. Na2 headers were an improvement over the Na1 headers.

 

[greenberet]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

...we were astonished with the results...

I agree: a 44.7 (19.5%) increase in rwhp in an otherwise stock naturally-aspirated NSX is a fantastic result for swapping out the exhaust system.

Judging by the graphs, the fuel cutoff seems to have shifted from 7614 rpm in May to 8155 rpm in December. Do you know what happened? Also, do you know whether the dyno was calibrated at any time between May and December?

I've had dyno measurements for my naturally-aspirated NSX vary between 238 rwhp and 408 rwhp with the car in the same state of tune. The numbers for your exhaust look great. I look forward to seeing what results you get if you can do a before/after test on the same dyno on the same day.

 

[Cody@LoveFab]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Over the weekend I'll reflect on how to handle selling headers by themselves. The obvious problem lies in the fact that nothing on the NSX market will bolt to the headers without modification. As for prior LoveFab owners with the older manifold design, the same situation presents itself; the secondaries(y-pipe) are completely different so the new headers will not simply bolt up.

We will be closed for the weekend and will return next week to better answer everyone's questions.

 

[clr1024]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

I've had dyno measurements for my naturally-aspirated NSX vary between 238 rwhp and 408 rwhp with the car in the same state of tune.

This seems ridiculous, how do you know what to believe with a spread like that. Seems like the only thing it would be good for would be finding the delta hp between baseline runs etc.

Sounds like a dyno calibration issue.

 

[goldNSX]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

We had never heard of a header/exhaust combo producing gains of over 45 WHP so we scrambled for explanations.

...and I'll never believe you it's doing 45 WHP. greenberet has a very nice catch on the max. rev. and that's why it does those WHP ON THE PAPER. Please redo the dynos before you claim a 45 WHP increase. :wink:

 

[Mac Attack]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

From the dyno overlay of the two runs you can see that at ~7600RPM (when the OEM dropped off), there is a significant difference - about 40HP.

So, this is a like-to-like comparison if you only look until 7600RPM assuming there isn't anything wrong with the base run.

There's a lot of variables. The OEM cats may have been close to getting clogged, etc. But, since this appears to be a complete system and I'm guessing he's using shorty style headers, I can see where he could get a big peak in HP at the upper RPMs.

For a complete system (headers, cats I assume, and cat-back), it doesn't make much difference in torque/power below 6500RPMs. It's only above 6500RPM where this really shines.

My guess is still a shorty style header with ~50mm diameter primaries (like common headers out there), but a larger collector diameter than normal all the way down!

Should be very impressive with your turbo system :biggrin:

Dave

 

[rotaryjunky]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

I can certainly vouch for the dyno. I was there for the first test of this NSX and my turbo miata has been on it many times, FMU 6psi, intercooled 8 psi, megasquirt 11.5 psi, 14psi, and finally AEM EMS at 14psi. When I install the built motor its going on again. Each time, this dyno has given results that correlate very closely with what one would expect with comparable setups. Subtle changes in timing, heat levels, etc.. always show up in the next run. And Cody certainly takes his time tuning, I make sure to have eaten before a dyno session.

For me, the power is just a bonus. The sound is absolutely incredible. I can't wait to drive to a meet and show it off. Of course, I am also simply dying to drive it, even down the street and back, to sample my new power. I need to be able to do it without coating the underside in salt, of course.

And there was absolutely nothing wrong with my cats before this installation. I used to own RX-7s, so I am sensitive to that problem.

 

[greenberet]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

For a complete system (headers, cats I assume, and cat-back), it doesn't make much difference in torque/power below 6500RPMs. It's only above 6500RPM where this really shines.

Below 6500 rpm the plots don’t show much of a gain, but they do show a gain at all rpm. Above 6500 rpm the gains are fantastic. If this system really gives you a maximum gain of 44.7 rwhp, that’s almost twice what any other system will give you. If that gain in peak power is real, I think I’ll ditch my entire current exhaust system.

Interestingly, not only does the fuel cutoff point seem to have shifted, so do the dips in the torque curve. An NSX’s torque curve usually dips just before the VVIS engages and then again just before VTEC engages. In the May run, it looks like the VVIS activated at about 4950 rpm and VTEC at about 5880 rpm. In the December run, it looks like the VVIS activated at about 5360 rpm and VTEC at about 6430 rpm. I wonder how that could happen without changing anything on the intake side of the engine or in the programming of the EMS.

In any case, a before/after run on the same dyno on the same day would be good to see!

 

[UnhuZ]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Hi,

i think the rpm differences in both dynos can be due to something related directly to the dyno equipement... i say this because i noticed last summer, when i installed a Dali Chip into My swiss friend's White NSX, in the before dyno, the fuel cutoff was at 82##rpms on the dyno display when i know for sure that the actual and true OEM rpm cutoff is at 8000rpms (give or take 50 :tongue

in the after dyno, the cutoff was at 8500rpms and i know that it should have been at 8200/8250 that is where the Dali Chip have it.

I asked the guy at the time, and he said that had something to do with the software and it's interpretation of the tire sizes and the speed test he did...

Nuno

 

[lithiumus]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

The biggest issue seems to be the inability to mate up with either the NA1 or NA2 OEM exhaust systems. That pretty much makes this completely proprietary and without seeing pictures, it may not even be viable to have custom piping fabricated to mate to the OEM locations.

This removes all those who have already invested significant dollars in an exhaust solution and have found a sound they like due to its' inability to mate with the OEM systems.

If at all possible, having adaptors to mate properly with NA1 and NA2 exhaust systems will open up the door completely to the NSX community. Are you planning on releasing this proprietary solution first and eventually releasing adaptors?

 

[greenberet]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

...he said that had something to do with the software and it's interpretation of the tire sizes and the speed test he did...

If a mistake somehow crept into the engine speed measurement and the fuel cutoff was at 8050 rpm on both runs, the results change. I believe a Mustang dyno actually measures torque and just calculates horsepower based on that and the engine speed. Wrong assumed engine speed, wrong calculated horsepower.

In May, the stock NSX hit its maximum horsepower 97.4% of the way to the fuel cutoff. If the fuel cutoff was actually at 8050 rpm, maximum horsepower was at 7840 rpm. At that speed, the engine put 162.5 lb/ft of torque to the wheels. Since horsepower = torque x rpm / 5252, that would mean the engine actually produced 242.6 rwhp at 7840 rpm.

In December, the NSX hit its maximum horsepower at the fuel cutoff and at that speed, the graph says it put out 177.5 lb/ft of torque. If that was actually at 8050 rpm, the NSX put out 272.1 rwhp.

So, if the torque measurements were correct but the fuel cutoff was actually at 8050 rpm in both cases, the LoveFab exhaust system resulted in an increase of 29.5 rwhp, which is still very good, but closer to what others have been able to achieve with headers / high flow cats / and a sports muffler. As a side note, if the fuel cutoff was at the same engine speed in both runs, the torque dips before VVIS and VTEC engagement line up a lot better. But that’s all just speculation. Dyno test!

 

[Mac Attack]

Re: Brand New LoveFab Headers. A First for the NSX Community!

Good analysis greenberet - I think you're right!

To the new owner - congratulations on your new exhaust. I would like to see some pictures because it must be a work of art like Cody's other designs! Enjoy!

Dave