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Diminished Value

Joined
4 September 2006
Messages
1,168
Location
New Orleans
I bought a 2009 Sierra Denali 2wd hard loaded on 12-31-09. Took delivery 1-4-10 with 650 miles on it. I was hit on 1-31-10 w/2000 miles on it, the accident was no fault of my own and it did 25K in damage. Truck is still in shop but that is irrelevant to the question at hand. Needles to say its gonna have paintwork down the entire left side, front bumper, and partial right side. Its also gonna have a major accident showing on Carfax if it doesn't already. I'm not happy about paying 50K for a truck that is now a major previously damaged truck, but again that I guess is irrelevant. BUT, when I attempt to sell or trade in one day, damn near everyone, especially a Dealer is gonna run a Carfax and deduct considerably in the offered value. So, I don't feel my truck has the same value anymore as it would of haved with no accident. How and to what degree can I get compensated from the INS Co. by claiming diminished value in this matter?
 
I bought a 2009 Sierra Denali 2wd hard loaded on 12-31-09. Took delivery 1-4-10 with 650 miles on it. I was hit on 1-31-10 w/2000 miles on it, the accident was no fault of my own and it did 25K in damage. Truck is still in shop but that is irrelevant to the question at hand. Needles to say its gonna have paintwork down the entire left side, front bumper, and partial right side. Its also gonna have a major accident showing on Carfax if it doesn't already. I'm not happy about paying 50K for a truck that is now a major previously damaged truck, but again that I guess is irrelevant. BUT, when I attempt to sell or trade in one day, damn near everyone, especially a Dealer is gonna run a Carfax and deduct considerably in the offered value. So, I don't feel my truck has the same value anymore as it would of haved with no accident. How and to what degree can I get compensated from the INS Co. by claiming diminished value in this matter?

Contact user JonBoy- he has had luck with that.

I was an insurance adjuster in TX for a few years, and I never paid a single DV claim- BUT that doesn't mean it isn't possible, and JonBoy is a good point of ref since he has a successful track record.

Phil
 
I got $2000 from the insurance company when my TL (like 1000 miles on it) was hit in Louisiana. I had to get a car dealer to sign off on it.
 
First of all I would push HARD to get the car totaled. Thats your best bet.

Second, I believe that most insurance companies factor in some kind of payment for diminished value. No?
 
Push HARD to get it totalled.

If that doesn't work, you're gonna have to do some legwork.

Get some "experts" on the subject to send letters to the insurance company. This could be key folks at car dealerships and/or someone with some communication skills at the body shop.

I wrote one myself, and had the GM of the Infiniti Dealership sign one that I wrote on his behalf. :biggrin:

Explain that with the widespread use of the internet and services like carfax, the spread of information is quick and accurate and consumers are less willing to purchase a vehicle that has been wrecked. It would follow that a car that has had extensive body and paint work is undoubtedly worth less than a car that hasn't.

I'd shoot for a few grand. Most would pay a few grand less for a car that has been repaired. Be fair.

Good luck.
 
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Second, I believe that most insurance companies factor in some kind of payment for diminished value. No?

In my experience, not unless you ask. :(
 
I'll throw in my two cents worth. I've had a number of diminished value claims that I successfully submitted to the other person's insurance company. One big point is that your own insurance company typically does not cover diminished value claims, regardless of whether or not you were at fault. You must submit this claim against the other party's insurance.

First of all, you will want to have a clearly documented repair with EVERY SINGLE ITEM clearly described. If you can, take pictures of the damage before they ever fix it. Since your vehicle was virtually brand new, it's prior condition should not require proof since it was probably in perfect condition.

Secondly, you need to account for how much value the vehicle has lost. You can do this a number of ways.

1. Take it to a few local dealerships and ask them for a written trade-in offer on the Denali against another vehicle on their lot. After you get that, let them know that it just had $25K in repair work and does their trade-in offer still stand? If not, ask them what the revised trade-in value would be. Get that in writing as well. The difference between the two is a reasonable amount that you can ask in reimbursement from the insurance company. You'd want to do this with a few different dealerships to get a consensus on what the vehicle is now worth.

2. Submit your vehicle details along with the repair bill to a company specializing in diminished value estimation. They will sometimes give you a rough estimate for free but you'll have to pay for an "official" estimate for vehicle value loss in the form of a report or letter on company stationary. Check out www.autoloss.com for an example of what I'm talking about.

Third, you'll need to submit all this information to the other person's insurance company. They will probably tell you that they don't do DV claims, etc, etc, but they do and they will play ball. Be reasonable in your request, ie, don't get estimates of $5K in diminished value and then go ask for $10K. Ask for what you have proof of because then they're going to ask for proof of the diminished value estimate. If you're way high over the estimates, they're going to back way off in a hurry and you'll end up getting a lawyer to sort it all out. Be calm, be factual, and be forthright and you should have success.

Let me know if you have any specific questions (in this thread or through PM) and I'll help any way I can.

Out of curiosity, were you injured at all? That can absolutely be used as leverage in negotiations for overall compensation for damages (vehicular and otherwise).

Good luck!
 
Thnx for the responses everyone. First off, let me say it's too late to go for a total cuz this happened back in Jan.


Heres the deal with the INS. co.'s I'm dealing with.

My INS in Farmers and of course full coverage.

The car at fault is Geico and they only have 10/20/10 coverage. So right from jump Geico told me they could not come close to covering my truck that I needed to go though my INS.
They wouldn't even give me a rental. And no, this is not my first ball game, I freaking tried everything and they held tough, no rental.
So, my Ins is repairing the truck, but I have to go though the others Ins for the DV claim, damn, this is gonna be fun :(

Also, do I need to do this before I sign off on the truck once its repaired or can it be done after I pick the truck up?
 
JonBOY is correct.

I recieved DV after my first NSX was hit a long time ago.
AFTER the car was repaired I went and got a professional appraisal on the work down on the car. The estimator took pics, and wrote a detailed explanation of why the car was now worth less. I submitted this to the insurance company and was paid no problem.

I don't recall the insurance company or many details, but I know it can be done!
 
Greg, it sounds like you are being covered under "uninsured motorist" coverage by your own insurance since the other person's coverage didn't extend enough to cover your repairs.

I am unsure as to the legal ramifications of that. I believe that most uninsured motorist coverage is only for physical damage, not for diminished value. However, you may successfully argue that the other party SHOULD have paid for diminished value and so your uninsured motorist coverage should do the same. Unfortunately, many times the insurance company has specific exclusions for claims under uninsured motorist coverage and one of them is often diminished value claims. You should be able to check your policy. If there is no exclusion specified, you can absolutely submit a claim for DV against your own insurance using uninsured motorist coverage.
 
this sucks. why the hell are 'liability' policies deemed adequate when in fact they don't cover squat? 10/20/10- thats a joke.
 
First post. I've been trolling for a while but I tend to keep to myself if I can’t add value to the conversation and I don’t have an NSX...

However, I was a very good Rep at Progressive for the last few years (which led to my current cushy state job) and I can say that the info here is mostly correct. Most auto polices do have exclusions for first party DV claims through the collision portion of your policy. As this person is underinsured (has insurance but not enough) you may be able to use under/uninsured motorist property damage (UMPD) coverage on your policy, that usually has a reduced deductible and NO exclusion on DV.

Obviously policies vary by state, but it would be pretty easy to read your policy contract (ask your agent if you don’t have one), just look under the UMPD section at the exclusions. UMPD is an optional coverage so you first have to make sure you have though. Then read if it covers both uninsured AND underinsured damages, as it may only cover uninsured damage. If this UMPD coverage does not apply, then you may unfortunately be SOL.

Geico will only pay back there minimum limits with a property damage release from your insurance saying that you/your insurance will not pursue the Geico insured for additional property damage payments. In order for you to get DV from Geico, your insurance would have to sign off on the release stating they are accepting the limits less your DV settlement (i.e. if you got 2k DV, your insurance would only get 8k of the Geico limits). As your insurance company is for profit, I wouldn't bet on them being ok with that (as there already losing thousands in money paid to fix your truck) but it’s a management decision so always worth a try.

You could pursue the at fault party through small claims, as they are legally responsible for all damage above there limits, but from my experience people rolling around with minimum limits have nothing of value, and could care less if there is a judgment against them, so that might not be worth the hassle. Your Insurance co. would likely do an asset check on them, but again, unless they see something of substantial value, they'll likely write off all unreimbursed cots as a business loss.

As for what to submit, all the advice is good. From my experience, which is likely quite similar to Geico (Progressive is 4th largest auto carrier, Geico is 3rd, and both share a similar business model) you will submit your DV documents (Jon Boy’s recommendations were all solid). A rep will give them to a Branch manager, and he will look ONLY at the year and value of you truck, and wing a response like 1-4k. You would think this stuff is reviewed, but usually not. They'll make you jump through hoops hoping you'll go away, but at the end of the day, they will pull a number out there buns. If I were you, I'd go for 10% of the vehicles value. A salvage title can typically reduce 25-50%, so its reasonable depreciation given your car will have an accident, but not a salvage title. That being said if you start at 10% they’ll negotiate down from there, so maybe start at fifteen for wiggle room...

Hope this all helped. Good luck.
 
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wow, thats a harsh reality. one thing i learned here- next time someone crashes into me, i will set the car on fire.:wink:
 
safe auto and other minimum coverage policies should not be legal:mad:
 
safe auto and other minimum coverage policies should not be legal:mad:

10/20/10 limits means 10k max paid per injury. Imagine these limits involved with a fatality. Not only should they be illegal, it's almost criminal to sell these policies. The average person who purchases this level of coverage is ignorant of what there getting, which is honestly nothing more then a false sense of security.
 
i don't think they care about 'sense of security'- they get the minimal coverage they can get away with, knowing they have nothing to get sued for anyway.
 
exactly,then we should all get "minimum" coverage...1-800 safe auto......:frown:
 
exactly,then we should all get "minimum" coverage...1-800 safe auto......:frown:

you don't have to convince me of this being wrong- i was 'waxed' by un-insured drunk before. at least carma took care of him (doa).
 
Shouldn't you sue the person who hit you even if they have no money? They might win the lottery some day.
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If you have to sue or use the threat of a lawsuit to motivate the person to reimburse you, I doubt you'll ever see a dime. If they somehow hoodwinked karma and won the lotto, they'd have so much money, they could easily avoid you and your attempts to be paid back. <o:p></o:p>
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Just because someone has minimum limits doesn’t mean there automatically a bad person with no sense of responsibility. I've literally handled hundreds of these claims and a lot of people are just ignorant to the huge risk there taking. I think a lot of the time, this should be on the insurance carrier for selling such a shitty policy. To increase limits is usually a minimal increase in premium. God forbid you point out that 5-10 more dollars would get you literally tens of thousands more in coverage.<o:p></o:p>
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In this case I'd just cross my fingers and hope they step up to the plate. Unless they were a douche, then I'd sue on principle.
 
First post. I've been trolling for a while but I tend to keep to myself if I can’t add value to the conversation and I don’t have an NSX...

However, I was a very good Rep at Progressive for the last few years (which led to my current cushy state job) and I can say that the info here is mostly correct. Most auto polices do have exclusions for first party DV claims through the collision portion of your policy. As this person is underinsured (has insurance but not enough) you may be able to use under/uninsured motorist property damage (UMPD) coverage on your policy, that usually has a reduced deductible and NO exclusion on DV.

Obviously policies vary by state, but it would be pretty easy to read your policy contract (ask your agent if you don’t have one), just look under the UMPD section at the exclusions. UMPD is an optional coverage so you first have to make sure you have though. Then read if it covers both uninsured AND underinsured damages, as it may only cover uninsured damage. If this UMPD coverage does not apply, then you may unfortunately be SOL.

Geico will only pay back there minimum limits with a property damage release from your insurance saying that you/your insurance will not pursue the Geico insured for additional property damage payments. In order for you to get DV from Geico, your insurance would have to sign off on the release stating they are accepting the limits less your DV settlement (i.e. if you got 2k DV, your insurance would only get 8k of the Geico limits). As your insurance company is for profit, I wouldn't bet on them being ok with that (as there already losing thousands in money paid to fix your truck) but it’s a management decision so always worth a try.

You could pursue the at fault party through small claims, as they are legally responsible for all damage above there limits, but from my experience people rolling around with minimum limits have nothing of value, and could care less if there is a judgment against them, so that might not be worth the hassle. Your Insurance co. would likely do an asset check on them, but again, unless they see something of substantial value, they'll likely write off all unreimbursed cots as a business loss.

As for what to submit, all the advice is good. From my experience, which is likely quite similar to Geico (Progressive is 4th largest auto carrier, Geico is 3rd, and both share a similar business model) you will submit your DV documents (Jon Boy’s recommendations were all solid). A rep will give them to a Branch manager, and he will look ONLY at the year and value of you truck, and wing a response like 1-4k. You would think this stuff is reviewed, but usually not. They'll make you jump through hoops hoping you'll go away, but at the end of the day, they will pull a number out there buns. If I were you, I'd go for 10% of the vehicles value. A salvage title can typically reduce 25-50%, so its reasonable depreciation given your car will have an accident, but not a salvage title. That being said if you start at 10% they’ll negotiate down from there, so maybe start at fifteen for wiggle room...

Hope this all helped. Good luck.

Everything here said is gospel.

Now, this is where I'm at. My Ins paid out 22K. They are ready to get compensated from Geico, so they called me to let me know what they were doing. Gieco offered them 8900 and they are giving the other car hit 1100 which of course equal there 10K. I said well, I will be seeking DV and my INS did not argue. I got a call the next day from Geico saying there experts said 1800. I told then very respectfully where to put that 1800 and that I currently had the local GMC dealership working on an actual value. She said OK, and I'm to get her that info when I get it. Now, keep in mind, I'm only to get a pro ratted portion of the 1800, prolly aprox 30% by my caculations. aproc 600 or so. That is ludicrous IMO, my 50K truck and I get 600 freaking dollars for DV!!!!! That doest even come close to ONE truck payment. Even if I get a proratted portion of 5 to 7K which I'm shooting for, its still NOT 5 to 7K which I SHOULD be getting!!!!
 
Everything here said is gospel.

Now, this is where I'm at. My Ins paid out 22K. They are ready to get compensated from Geico, so they called me to let me know what they were doing. Gieco offered them 8900 and they are giving the other car hit 1100 which of course equal there 10K. I said well, I will be seeking DV and my INS did not argue. I got a call the next day from Geico saying there experts said 1800. I told then very respectfully where to put that 1800 and that I currently had the local GMC dealership working on an actual value. She said OK, and I'm to get her that info when I get it. Now, keep in mind, I'm only to get a pro ratted portion of the 1800, prolly aprox 30% by my caculations. aproc 600 or so. That is ludicrous IMO, my 50K truck and I get 600 freaking dollars for DV!!!!! That doest even come close to ONE truck payment. Even if I get a proratted portion of 5 to 7K which I'm shooting for, its still NOT 5 to 7K which I SHOULD be getting!!!!

At this point I would contact your insurance, and ask to speak to whatever manager it takes to discuss their subrogation claim (the part of the claim where Geico pays them back). Respectfully argue your points about your loss in value, your tenure as there insured (obviously the longer the better). In all reality there going to be out a lot of money no matter what. If you can get them to agree to accept a payment less your DV claim, it might be thousands lost, but it would go a long way towards customer service/retention. Once you get that agreement do a 3 way call to Geico, make sure the Geico rep (or manager) understands that agreement (have your insurance mail you and Geico a letter explaining what the agreement is in detail). Once you and Geico have the letter, negotiate in dollar amounts, not percentages.

If they Prorated the other drivers payment to 1100, they either had 1100 in total damage, or there damage only represented 11% of the total amount of property damage done to all cars. Either way, they have approx 9k to work with you to resolve your DV claim. Keep the threat of a lawsuit against there insured in the forefront, as they have a duty to protect there insured. If they know your insurance is ok accepting a reduced payment, they might be more willing to negotiate. As it stands there insured is facing possible legal pursuit from both you and your insurance company. As a business decision, if they can eliminate the threat of one of those legal claims they will.

There is an off chance this could benefit Geico. If your insurance is agreeable to this (big if), Geico could likely explain to there insured they can resolve your DV claim, and your insurance might write off the unpaid balance as a business loss, effectively eliminating his risk on your portion of the claim. It's a whole lot more likely a multi-million dollar co. will write off a few thousand then it is you'll not come after this guy in small claims for your DV claim.

If I'm the rep handling this, which is also likely the rep trying to resolve your injury claims (as Geico uses a generalist model, like Progressive) that rep knows the more he does to placate you, the better it is for him in the long run. He knows if you think he went to bat for you to resolve your DV claim, that should get him some 'good faith points' when it comes time to settle your injury claims. I know that was my model, keep injured person happy at all costs, eventually my bosses would give in. No need to turn the thumb screws on someone who is already facked IMO.

Also, if possible, and the Geico rep is not an a**hole, think about taking it easy on him. Trust me, we reps hate are job. It sucks. We know your getting screwed, and we represent the party doing the screwing. We hate ourselves a lot of the time. And like I said, he probably wants to keep you happy. Its funny how far the rules can "bend" in certain situations. I know I went head over heels helping a lady with a total loss cause it was a car her and her deceased husband purchased together and it was beyond valuable to her. Just my two cents.

Again, hope all of this helps. Best of luck.
 
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