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New Brakes, New Rotors=Difficulty stopping. Clueless?

xiongb1 said:
ABS started chattering for 10-15 secs barely moving pulling out of the driveway. 2nd time it started chattering was roughly around the same speed. Just rolling.

Ha, yes fight as in Pedal is hard and still no power brake. Stops like a 60s vehicle equipped with drum brakes as comparison.
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What's happening is there is NO pad material on the rotor. Brake pads use pad material (transferred to the rotor) against pad material on the pad to slow the vehicle. Until that happens the pad is rubbing against the iron surface of the rotor and will not stop easily and may even make a "grinding" noise.

Go bed them in.... They should look like this when you get back.

brakebed-in3.jpg
 
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Jim is right! There is no pad material.

When you put the new pads, did you grease the pins that will allow the caliper to move? Were you able to push the pistons easily? Given that the pedal is hard - (ie probably no air in the lines), perhaps the pins are your issue.

[And I see you are not using what I thought was a BBK two piece rotor - though this shouldn't matter.]
 
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Hrant said:
Jim is right! There is no pad material.

When you put the new pads, did you grease the pins that will allow the caliper to move? Were you able to push the pistons easily? Given that the pedal is hard - (ie probably no air in the lines), perhaps the pins are your issue.

[And I see you are not using what I thought was a BBK two piece rotor - though this shouldn't matter.]
Click to expand...

I think what is happening is most people change fronts or rears only and it's not as dramatic for the first few stops as only one end doesn't have pad material on the rotors. He changed all four at the same time and the first two or three stops from low speed freaked him out. None of the rotors have ANY pad material and driving around the neighborhood at low speed isn't going to help. They need to be beeded in and THEN if the hard stopping continues start looking for problems.
 
Yes thank you guys. And CL65 Captain I've changed all four drilled/ slotted rotors with HPS on my RX7 and didnt have to go thru any bedding process. Stops like it should. I've also never used Stoptech Rotors before and never done any brake change on a NSX before. I was just confused, but I'll give your advice a try tomorrow.

Thanks again and appreciated much..:)
 
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The ABS chattering is a red herring - unrelated to the problem. After start-up and once you've moved some number of feet (or reached a couple MPH) the abs pump will run for a second, sometimes longer (recent brake pad change, recent brake fluid flush/bleed, stuck solenoid, etc), to initially pressurize the system.

As others have stated the most-likely cause is the rotors/pads are not yet bedded in (or mated topographically with the rotors) and/or the film from the rotors is interfering.
 
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I have the stoptech slotted rotors and Hawk HPS pads as well. When I put on the new rotors, and the new pads at the same time, it also felt like you are describing. Trust me, it gets better, just like the others said, it takes a bit of driving at moderate speeds to get the pad material transferred. Just give yourself some space to do this so you aren't risking running into anyone else.

And the chattering, as was mentioned, is most likely the ABS pump pressurizing the system. Don't let it freak you out.
 
CL65 Captain said:
Don't listen to Caroline, she has no idea what she is talking about. Hawk makes great pads. I have driven on everything from HPS, Hp +, blues and dtc70s. The pad is not your problem. Virgin rotors need to be bedded in and will stop poorly until pad material is transfered to the rotor.

However, your abs should not be activating. Especially bothersome is the comment that Abs was chattering before even getting out of the driveway.... I don't think I could get my abs to activate under 30 in the wet slamming on the brakes.

I think your problem lies with the install.
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Hahahaha.What you think you was the only one that tried hawks pads?We have used those too and had the same problem.We thought maybe because its new and need to bed in as well but after two weeks of bedding it in it was still doing the same thing and taking a long time to come to a complete stop.I have no idea what I am talking about?I do because we had the same set up AND had the same problem he is having AND bought it from SOS as well.We removed the Slot rotors and hawk pads and reinstalled the old rotors and the old pads and it work 5 times better than the new rotors (Slots) and pads (Hawks). Come on now CL65 Captain, you might been around here for awhile but I been there and done that so I know what I am talking about.I can tell you one thing.If it AIN'T the pads it have to be the rotors.I'm just trying to help a member out.Slot rotors and Hawk pads is garbage.Well to me they are. :wink::smile:
 
like said before the discs need bedding in, the disc / pad combo is a excelent one, personally i like to use ether hawk or ebc. i have noticed that some rotors do come extra greasy but that should burn off or spray them clean with brake cleaner. Clicking from the abs pump is a very common one we get that question often.
 
Theres no pad transfer to the disc. Depending on surface finish, some rotors or pad material bed quicker than others.

Go follow the hawk bedin orocedure and USE the brakes. They will probably fade during bedin which is fine and they might not even be perfect for a week or two later. The harder you drive it the sooner it eill work properly.
 
y not call SOS for advice? i'm sure they can point u in the right direction.
 
If after bedding it still doesn't stop properly you may want to check the brake proportioning valve. If it is stuck(rare but can happen during a full flush) you may only have hydraulic pressure to 2 of the 4 wheels.
 
EdinKali said:
If after bedding it still doesn't stop properly you may want to check the brake proportioning valve. If it is stuck(rare but can happen during a full flush) you may only have hydraulic pressure to 2 of the 4 wheels.
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Not if its just an orifice reducer with no moving parts. Do we know for sure what kind the stock "valve" is?
 
stuntman said:
Not if its just an orifice reducer with no moving parts. Do we know for sure what kind the stock "valve" is?
Click to expand...

I think most OEM style are the piston type vs. orifice so that if you lose hydraulic pressure in part of the system you don't lose all of your braking ability. Don't know for sure on the NSX though. Trying to find some info on it or a good picture but coming up empty so far.

To be honest, I only see a proportioning valve on the 2000 and later NSX's. The early ones may not have had them or maybe it was incorporated into the ABS assembly.
 
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I think that you had more than enough time to bed them brakes in.How are the brakes?Got any better from bedding it in?Any updates? :smile:
 
EdinKali said:
I think most OEM style are the piston type vs. orifice so that if you lose hydraulic pressure in part of the system you don't lose all of your braking ability. Don't know for sure on the NSX though. Trying to find some info on it or a good picture but coming up empty so far.

To be honest, I only see a proportioning valve on the 2000 and later NSX's. The early ones may not have had them or maybe it was incorporated into the ABS assembly.
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What is a "piston type"?

Ive also seen it in the parts list for the later models as a small in-line component that is separte from the master cylinder and abs modulator. This further shows the emphasis of biasing the front brakes on the nsx.
 
stuntman said:
What is a "piston type"?

Ive also seen it in the parts list for the later models as a small in-line component that is separte from the master cylinder and abs modulator. This further shows the emphasis of biasing the front brakes on the nsx.
Click to expand...

There are probably better drawings out there to illustrate this but this is the first one I came across. It is called a piston in this drawing but it could also be called a "valve" if you will since it can close off or restrict flow to ports.

http://www.freeasestudyguides.com/proportioning-valve-diagnosis.html

Here is a pic of one from a VW that is taken apart.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_OteM3ZntRio/S-yO9E-CwfI/AAAAAAAABL0/KC-X-ZDoxV0/s1600/CIMG4865.JPG
 
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