Paul walker dies at age 40

[Texas91Brent]

I've heard people around here call that car the widow maker for years. It has killed several people and many more have been crashed.

Did the other cars split in half or explode? Maybe someone in Walkers camp could look into a lawsuit? Probably not car was built in 2005?

 

[Bigglezworth]

There is nothing to blame other than driver error here. Simple as that. Racing on a street where there is NO runout is a prescription for disaster. Had the events leading up to this tragedy unfolded on a race track, the car would have still experienced problems, but not have been split in two and catching fire. Stated everyday and abandonded constantly by those that feel they could never be affected. Leave the racing to a controled invironment like a race track. They are designed to better handle high speed failure - be it mechanical or driver.

 

[Hasdrubal]

Bigglezworth, I think you have it exactly right. Look at the history of F1 racing, more of the danger in the past was from the design of the circuits than the strength of the cars. A few decades ago you had tracks with steel guardrails ranging from several inches to several feet away from the track, or trees at the same distance. You still see this with rally, look at Robert Kubica, arm nearly severed by a guardrail that punched completely through the car.

When F1 started taking it seriously, the tracks started to cut the trees back, replaced the steel rails with tire barriers, and provided huge amounts of runoff area so the cars would shed most of their speed before hitting anything. There hasn't been a fatality in that series since Senna, and the tracks designed since then have had even larger amounts of runoff, and chicanes have been added to reduce the speed at corner entry. You will never see a corner on a Tilke track like Tamburello circa 1994.

This is still a tragedy, but physics is a harsh and unforgiving mistress. We do what we can to minimize the risk, or pay the price. Sometimes, you pay the price regardless.

 

[blue_myriddn]

Not sure how fast the Porsche CGT really was, but I fear ' a bit' faster than allowed.

This comment make the most sense.......
.........
This happened at a business park located in Rye Canyon near Santa Clarita, California.

During a car show that Paul was using to support his charity “Reach Out Worldwide”, Paul and Roger Rodas (The Owner) of Always Evolving Performance, where the event was held decided to take his red Porsche for a spin.

They left the AEP parking lot turning right onto Alta Vista Ave. They then turned right onto Constellation Rd, and then right again onto Kelly Johnson Pkwy where the driver began testing the limits of the Porsche.

Northbound Kelly Johnson Pkwy has a small s curve and a wide sweeping right turn that turns into Hercules St. This business park loop is infamous for drivers using it as a race track and the “Hercules Curve” is where they test their drifting skills.

Paul and Roger’s speed was far too fast into the curve and the car’s rear end kicked out toward the driver side. The driver then over corrected and the passenger side rear end kicked out to the passenger side.

Since I am visual, I took this text and mapped it out. The only thing I adjusted was that it didn't make sense to be going RIGHT on to Constellation road, so I assumed they meant LEFT. It is a pretty short run.

 

[BATMANs]

It's a good thing that I don't find Porsche cars that attractive. I mean they look like a 350Z and a MKIV boink and had kids.

Any of you guys old enough to remember the Cursed 550?

That "Little Bastard" not only killed James Dean, but killed and maimed others who came in contact with it causing many to say that the damn thing was cursed. George Barris, who customized the 550 originally, bought the wrecked carcass of "Little Bastard" for $2500 and soon after it slipped off its trailer and broke a mechanics leg. Not long after Barris sold the engine and drivetrain to Troy McHenry and William Eschrid. While the two were both racing against one another in cars that had parts from the "Little Bastard," McHenry lost control and hit a tree, killing him instantly and Eschrid was seriously injured when his car suddenly locked up and rolled over while going into a turn. Barris still had two tires from the 550 which were untouched in Dean's accident. He sold them and not long after, both blew out simultaneously causing the new owner's car to run off the road. Barris had kept the car in his possession sans the sold parts and it caught the attention of two would-be thieves. One of the thieves arms was torn open trying to steal the steering wheel while the other was injured trying to remove the bloodstained tartan seat.

Due to all the incidents involving "Little Bastard," Barris decided to hide the car but was convinced by the California Highway Patrol to lend the cursed heap to a highway safety exhibit. The first exhibit was unsuccessful as the garage that housed the car caught fire and burned to the ground. Mysteriously the car suffered virtually no damage from the fire. The next exhibition at a local high school ended abruptly when the car fell off its display and broke a nearby student's hip.

The curse continued when the "Little Bastard" was being transported when the truck carrying the car lost control which caused the driver to fall out and somehow get crushed by the car after it fell off the back. The car fell off of two more transport trucks while travelling on the freeway fortunately not injuring anyone. The CHP decided that it had had enough of the "Little Bastard" and while transporting the car to Barris, the car mysteriously vanished and has not been seen since.

 

[bzyrice]

^ crazy

 

[Bigglezworth]

The police are certain to say that the driver was 'driving too fast for the situation', but I personally would further qualify this as being "driving too fast for the location". I say this only as the same 'situation' could have occurred on a track where the car/driver were racing around a sweeping right curve and something failed on the car or loss of control occurred. The variable that caused the death here was not the speed (obviously speed compounded things), not the ability for the car to handle the speed, not the ability of the driver to handle the speed (as the driver was an accomplished race car driver), not the design of the car or the location of the gas tank, etc, etc, etc. It is simply the fact that there were too many other obstacles on or near the roadway that could and DID further compromise the loss of control. I've done some gardening with my car a couple of times out at our local race track and the only casualty was my ego and a loss of a near new wheel/tire. Tracks are designed to account for the fact that cars can - and WILL - go off course at the hands of mechanical or human error. Tracks focus on lessening/eliminiating the opportunity for serious injury or worse.

 

[Texas91Brent]

The police are certain to say that the driver was 'driving too fast for the situation', but I personally would further qualify this as being "driving too fast for the location". I say this only as the same 'situation' could have occurred on a track where the car/driver were racing around a sweeping right curve and something failed on the car or loss of control occurred. The variable that caused the death here was not the speed (obviously speed compounded things), not the ability for the car to handle the speed, not the ability of the driver to handle the speed (as the driver was an accomplished race car driver), not the design of the car or the location of the gas tank, etc, etc, etc. It is simply the fact that there were too many other obstacles on or near the roadway that could and DID further compromise the loss of control. I've done some gardening with my car a couple of times out at our local race track and the only casualty was my ego and a loss of a near new wheel/tire. Tracks are designed to account for the fact that cars can - and WILL - go off course at the hands of mechanical or human error. Tracks focus on lessening/eliminiating the opportunity for serious injury or worse.

I disagree with the design and location of the fuel tank.
The Porsche should not have split in half and explode upon side impact to a sign or tree....If nothing else, a stronger seperated fuel cell not located directly behind driver and passenger. You can design a fuel cell that can withstand impact. That would have allowed time to rescue the occupants. I have seen alot of accidents, even involving trees, and telephone poles, none of them caused the cars to explode.

 

[Bigglezworth]

I disagree with the design and location of the fuel tank.
The Porsche should not have split in half and explode upon side impact to a sign or tree....If nothing else, a stronger seperated fuel cell not located directly behind driver and passenger. You can design a fuel cell that can withstand impact. That would have allowed time to rescue the occupants. I have seen alot of accidents, even involving trees, and telephone poles, none of them caused the cars to explode.

Close minded logic and entirely missing the point. This level of thinking would have you believe that the Titanic wouldn't have sank if it had a thicker hull..... This is solely about a needless accident having taken place in the first instance that - fire aside - could have more than easily caused death. I reiterate - it has nothing to do with gas tank design (or any other mechanical failure that could surface as part of the investigation) and everything to do with lack of common sense.

My opinion aside - this is obviously a tragic situation regardless and no matter who feels what was at fault, the loss of life is unfortunate and has/will affect many.

 

[EAC]

There are already pictures of their bodies floating around the internet. Terrible..

 

[BATMANs]

The split face one? looks fake since it's not even charred...

 

[EAC]

The split face one? looks fake since it's not even charred...

This one isn't fake. I won't post a link, but it's on liveleak.

 

[SOURCE 1]

This one isn't fake. I won't post a link, but it's on liveleak.

Don't look if you have a weak stomach

 

[BATMANs]

It's just a picture in the night of blurry bodies.

Nothing major.

I think they hit a gas line that made them burn.

 

[Ko-nsx]

It's just a picture in the night of blurry bodies.
Nothing major.

The pics have been outlined. You cant tell anything in detail but you can see burned bodies.

 

[BATMANs]

i know. that's not nasty IMHO. I've seen worse.

 

[Shaylord]

It's just a picture in the night of blurry bodies.

Nothing major.

I think they hit a gas line that made them burn.

That wasn't a gas line, it was a water line with a back flow preventer, double-check valve from the look of it. But I think if the car did hit that it looks like it would be 2" diameter galv steel sch 40 pipe. Being how it was anchored on both ends (up, over, and back down) it would of been very strong and caused a lot of damage to car especially against a carbon fiber body. It was even probably anchored in cement. Most people wouldn't think so as they have seen people hit fire hydrants and it not do to much damage, and you would think a fire hydrant would be more rugged bases on the size and the construction. But they are actually designed to snap off incase a car hits them, normally have hollow bolts.

 

[myw]

well said and spoken. agreed completely in all counts.

Close minded logic and entirely missing the point. This level of thinking would have you believe that the Titanic wouldn't have sank if it had a thicker hull..... This is solely about a needless accident having taken place in the first instance that - fire aside - could have more than easily caused death. I reiterate - it has nothing to do with gas tank design (or any other mechanical failure that could surface as part of the investigation) and everything to do with lack of common sense.

My opinion aside - this is obviously a tragic situation regardless and no matter who feels what was at fault, the loss of life is unfortunate and has/will affect many.

 

[Miner]

Speed Kills.
A modern car is safer than one 20 years ago, but speed negates some (sometimes all) of that.

 

[steveny]

I share this sentiment. F1, NASCAR and Indy Cars all possess this level of performance or greater and the drivers will almost always walk away from a shunt like this. If you build a 600 hp car that can go 200 mph, I think it should be crash rated at those speeds. The NSX is, for example. H-frame with steel beams in the door structure. Plenty of shockingly mangled NSX wrecks on the salvage thread where the drivers walked away.

Plant trees, install phone poles and other stationary solid non deflective items on the sides of the track surface and almost every race car accident making contact with such would result in a casualty. The streets are not for racing well at least not until properly angled walls are installed that deflect and shed speed with the car at a proper angle.

I could make an almost endless list of race car drivers which have been killed from hitting the wall at the track at just the correct angle which causes rapid deceleration and death. This is true of any type of race car. A driver can flip a car multiple times, slide it down a wall from one corner to the next and pretty much walk away because of slow deceleration.

Blow a tire coming out of a corner, head up the track straight for the corner fail to turn and you're dead. Hit the end of the pit wall, you're dead. In fact just a few years back in think 07 Ben Keaton from the Ferrari club was killed in his CGT hitting a stationary cement reinforcement. My personal view is that the track where Keaton perished is dangerous in and of itself as the cars exiting the pits come right into the race line. Even so Keaton was killed and as well his passenger. They were only going ~145mph. There have been multiple deaths in the CGT. The CGT isn't called the widow maker for effect, its a very dangerous car and IMO should never have been sold to the general public. Or maybe Porsche should have included training in the sales agreement?

With that being said, I have watched the video of the walker wreck and observed it while zooming in closely to the flames. Being that there are no reports of any bystanders being hurt I have to sadly said that someone in walkers CGT was fully conscious after the wreck and was desperately trying to exit the car. To me its pretty clear a figure in the center of the flames doing what appears to be yanking at the seat belt maybe and trying to escape then finally dropping back into the fire. The only other explanation I can come up with would be someone on the other side of the car, the side which wasn't be videoed trying to extinguish the flames then setting the empty canister down on the ground. However putting out a couple car fires myself I know beyond the shadow of a doubt the person doing so would have serious burns and I'm sure that would also be in the news.

Edit. After going to the liveleak link in this thread its petty obvious someone, the body walker according to liveleak, was standing at some point after the crash just form looking at the positioning of the body laying within the wreckage.

This is why I had installed on my Ferrari and boat a fire suppressant system and why I would recommend to at least have a fire extinguisher in your vehicle if you don't have one already. I have witnessed two people burn to death before my eyes and it never leaves your mind.

 

[Procar Specials]

I wonder what really happened?
Forensic will show who was behind the wheel.

Biggest german newspaper wrote today that speed was over 100mph.
Via Google maps I tried to imagine to take that right corner before with 160km/h +

Noticed that this street dont have white lines in the middle as routings, I only can see small.higher inserts into the asphalt, whats that?
https://maps.google.de/maps?q=25601+Hercules+Street,+Santa+Clarita,+California&hl=de&ll=34.452424,-118.580683&spn=0.000004,0.002956&sll=34.452457,-118.576963&sspn=0.007918,0.016512&hnear=25601+Hercules+St,+Santa+Clarita,+California+91355,+USA&t=m&layer=c&cbll=34.452506,-118.580641&panoid=ixVkdmbmlN6mXxA6gU7JoQ&z=19&cbp=12,32.69,,0,18.03

Biggest german car magazine called that car a 'street sweeper' (Straßenfeger)

The next street sweeper is still in the pipeline...

This is an interesting comment (in german language)

Jeder kann bei Wikipedia nachlesen, dass dieser Porschetyp als Rennwagen für Le Mans konzipiert wurde, jedoch nie zum Einsatz kam, jedoch in einer Kleinserie "für die Straße" an solvente Kunden ging. Ein leichtgewichtiges Geschoß mit 620 PS (450kw), das an sich ein Unterbodenluftleitsystem erfordert, damit das Auto bei höheren Geschwindigkeiten nicht einfach abhebt. Möchtegern-Rennfahrer - auch wenn sich diese als "Profis" bezeichnen, sind mit solchen Fahrzeugen regelmäßig überfordert, wenn sie das erste Mal damit unterwegs sind. An das Fahrverhalten und die brachiale Leistungsentfaltung muß man sich über einen längeren Zeitraum gewöhnen und den Grenzbereich sachte, Stück für Stück, kennenlernen. Natürlich macht es Spaß, bei diesem Auto Vollgas zu geben. Jedoch nur auf einer langen Geraden. Bis man anfängt das Auto zu beherrschen und nicht mehr von ihm beherrscht wird. Wieso bei bis zur Unkenntlichkeit verbrannten Leichen, bei denen zur Identifizierung die Zahnschemata angefordert werden mußten, noch vor deren Auswertung fest steht, wer gefahren ist und wer auf dem Beifahrersitz saß, ist ebenfalls nicht nachvollziehbar. Schlußendlich hat sich ein Fahrer restlos überschätzt - mit finalem Ausgang für alle Insassen. Glücklicherweise hat diese unsinnige Aktion nicht auch noch Unbeteiligte in den Tod gerissen. Schade um die zwei Menschenleben - jedoch nicht zu ändern.

 

[BATMANs]

Anyone can read at Wikipedia that this Porsche type was designed as a racing car for Le Mans , but was never used , however, in a small series " for the road " to solvent customers went . A lightweight bullet with 620 hp ( 450kW ) which is a sub-floor air handling system requires in to the car is not simply lifts off at higher speeds. Wannabe racers - even if they refer to as " professionals" , are regularly overwhelmed by such vehicles when they are thus the first time on the road . On the ride and the awesome power delivery have to get used over a longer period and the border area gently , little by little get to know . Of course it 's fun to go full throttle in this car. However, only on a long straight . Until you , the car begins to dominate and is no longer controlled by it . Why when burned beyond recognition bodies , in which the tooth schemes had to be requested to identify, even before their evaluation it is clear who has traveled and who was in the passenger seat , is also not understandable. Finally, a driver has completely overrated - with final output for all occupants . Fortunately, this senseless action has not broken even innocent bystanders to death. Pity about the two lives - but not to change .

 

[Moses]

Sucks......
Autopsy results:

The autopsies on Paul Walker and Roger Rodas have been completed, says the Los Angeles County coroner's office.

Update, 1:10 p.m. ET: Official causes of death: Rodas, the driver of the vehicle, died of multiple traumatic injuries; Walker, the passenger, died of the combined effects of traumatic and thermal injuries, the Los Angeles county coroner's office said, reports CNN.

The deaths were ruled to be accidental. Toxicology results are pending, and could take several weeks.

 

[06_typeS]

So from what I get from that is that he didn't die on impact? Or was unconscious.

I have read through his whole thread and haven't commented until now. I feel a huge loss in the automotive community. He is the one I got me into the car scene so many years ago. May he rest in peace.

 

[BATMANs]

Walker, the passenger, died of the combined effects of traumatic and thermal injuries