Type R bar bangs w/sway bar

[Hrant]

This is good news. A few clarifying questions if you don't mind.

1. With the stock suspension and 6mm spacers, did you notice any issues with the sway bar touching the radiator cooling pipe? The clearance there is about 15 mm at best anyway! So 7 mm made the difference of clearing with Type R suspension? When we looked at the option of removing the spacer, with some visual inspection, we did not think it would clear the cooling pipe enough to give about the 0.75" to 1" clearance we needed for the Comptech sway bar and brace over the battery tray. We tested this by putting load on the wheels not just jacked up in the air.

2. Do you carry your spare tire? Your avatar seems to show larger aftermarket wheels. Any issues with the spare tire?

Al and I are approaching this solution from a slightly different angle and we are awaiting some customized parts to arrive.

But shaving the spacers down seems a solution worthwhile to explore further especially if a different suspension set up seems to solve the rubbing. I have Bilsteins lower perch on stock springs; Comptech sway bars.

I too have noticed a considerable stiffness in my 98-T but even with only installing the brace in front of the radiator; especially the steering has lost its wishy washy feel at 60-80 mph. I am at a point where I am wondering if the brace under the sway bar will be too much! Mine is both street 65% / track use 35%. I also have the Comptech engine strut bar for the T and that has added some stiffness too - especially noticeable when one makes a hard angle turn on the driveway, the body flexes less.

 

[NSXLuvr]

This is good news. A few clarifying questions if you don't mind.

1. With the stock suspension and 6mm spacers, did you notice any issues with the sway bar touching the radiator cooling pipe?

2. Do you carry your spare tire? Your avatar seems to show larger aftermarket wheels. Any issues with the spare tire?

Sorry for the delay,

1. With the stock suspension, the car would still bump the coolant bracket at a couple of places around town. I could have easily avioded the dip in the road, but decided to test the car out. when I way on the track, I had no issues. With the Type R Shocks, the car is so stiff that there is no contact with the coolant bracket. I haven't tested it at the track yet(3 more weeks), then I will give my final report.

2. I still carry my spare. I have 17/18's with SO3's

 

[ATERPAK]

Hrant and I have finally solved the problem on this and I'm in the process of getting the parts made. I need to know how many are interested in the fix. Also it should not require any cutting of the battery tray or bending of any other parts as far as we can determine. It's not a cheap fix but it does work.

 

[zoomnsx]

Al,
If it's for the NSX-T, I'm interested. By the way, I
did receive the lip spoiler.

Thanks,
John

 

[Hrant]

Yes it is for the 97+ model years (and a variation is under consideration for pre 97 model years that have really thicker sway bars like Dali's track or race sway bars).

For 97+ coupe or T doesn't make a difference since the issue - as aptly catalogued by Jadkar above - is aftermarket sway bars that give less clearance due to 97+ model cars using spacers where the sway bar brackets mount due to larger spare wheel because of the larger front brakes introduced in 97+, which in turn caused them to change the location of the radiator hose on the left fender, which .......

It took us numerous trials with many meticulous fine tuning with different scenarios. We were really surprised as to how rigid the NSX chassis was. We believe the solution should allow for further individual minor fine tuning to allow for small variations amongst NSXs with different sway bars, shocks and springs. Our template was based on using Comptech's adjustable sway bars with Bilstein on lower perch and OEM springs. Installation should take no more than 15 minutes once you have jacked the front up - no need to take the wheels off.

A side note, in one of our scenarios where the sway bar was touching the Type R bar but not compressing on it enough to cause visibile rubbing and clunking, the car's front was noticeably stiffer when compared to without such touching. That is an indication of how much more stiff the sway bars became if they could no longer float and flex at will - and I already had them on the stiffest position. As a tracker, while I liked the stiffer feel, I could also hear some tweaks and noises from the door/T-top roof area. Since we were looking for a solution and not excuse, we kept tinkering with the fine tuning ....

One of the parts that Al will be manufacturing will have another beneficial application besides its use in installing the Type R lower brace in 97+ models.

We will post pictures once the parts are machined to our (Al will argue its my) a$al specifications. We hope to have the parts in time to test it at Infineon (Sears Point) in 10 days.

As you can see, Al is being modest, and obviously he has not taken any marketing courses .... some of us are working on that with him

 

[zoomnsx]

Hrant,
Good marketing pitch. Now, I'm not only interested, but curious as well.
Mods that can be fine tuned should always be a designers objective.
When it's available, show us the photos, price, and lead time. Put me in
your list.

Thanks,
John

 

[ATERPAK]

All right I've finally got the parts we need to fix this problem to a machine shop and they should be done in a week or so. I'm taking orders for the kit Hrant and I have mentioned and I'm making enough parts for 10 kits at this time. They will be priced at $60 + $5 shipping for the first 10 who order and pay for them. This mod. will allow for you to keep your spare tire and has been tested using a Comptech sway bar which is pretty large. Instructions will be in the kit and it will require nominal wrenching skills.

If you're interested please send a check to:

Al Terpak
P.O. Box 276212
Sacramento, CA 95827

All future kits will be $75 plus shipping.

 

[ATERPAK]

It has also come to my attention, (my own car) which is a 91 with a heavier duty Dali style setup, that even the earlier cars need some clearance for the sway bar with the Type R braces. It seems that this Type R reinforcement kit has been sold to us without the full story being told in that you need a different sway bar as well.

With that in mind I now have kits which will fit all years of NSX's for the Type R braces and which will also allow for you to clear the sway bar and keep your spare tires.

91-96 model year kits will go for $35 + $5 shipping.
96-2004 model year kits will go for $60 + $5 shipping.

They're in stock ready to ship so send checks to:

Al Terpak
P.O. Box 276212
Sacramento, CA 95827

 

[MJK]

FWIW, I have the following configurations on a 94 and have never had a problem with rubbing or banging:

a) completely stock suspension + NSX R bars + 15" spare
b) stock shocks & springs + NSX-R bars + CT sways + 15" spare
c) stock shocks & springs + NSX-R bars + CT sways + 16" spare
d) Zanardi springs + konis + NSX-R bars + CT sways + 16" spare

I can't speak the to the NSX-Ts, but it seems the Dali bars might be the problem on the coupes. Hopefully Al's solution fixes this

 

[ATERPAK]

Drop the lower R brace and recheck it for rubbing. I didn't think I had any prolbems either but after an inspection, I noticed significant rubbing. I could be wrong but it's worth checking.

 

[Hrant]

Finally the long awaited pics of the install. I kept telling Al to wait, but you should all know by now, the Fearless Leader has a mind of his own .......

The pics are step by step install and are self explanatory. You may need to enlarge them to read the the comments.

HTH

Enjoy.

 

[Hrant]

The remaining pics.

 

[Hrant]

Forgot to post the final pic as to why went through all this trouble ............. !

 

[Hrant]

A final belated note.

Once again, NSXPrime proved to be a great forum to discuss and resolve technical issues, such as this Type R installation. I want to specially thank JADKAR for his persistent investigative work with excellent pictures, as well as DONYMO and NSXLuvr for their very insightful ideas and solutions.

While Al and I spent some 20+ hours in R&D and actual testing on/off the track, if you read the threads all over again as I just did, you will see that the solutions were already floating there, it was a matter of executing them

 

[Ponyboy]

Well, my experience is a little different. The bottom chassis bar actually comes in contact with the exit hose of the radiator. The rad is an aftemarket Ron Davis and the bottom male end of the hose/rad combo comes in contact with the bar. I really don't want to decrease the diameter of that part and possibly restrict flow. So the only avenues are to either get rid of the bottom bar (bah!) or use the chassis bar spacer above to fit the chassis bar immediately below the battery tray. Unless someone else has a better idea...

 

[VBNSX]

I refuse to let this thread die.. :tongue:

Anywho.. I USED to never have a problem with the sway bar (comptech) and bottom type-r bar.

Well when you lower the car is where the problems come up. Stock everything was hunky-dorie.

Put the teins on and poof.. i get this viscious clunkying sound (at the track). I pm'd aterpak to see if I could buy a set. Hopefully I can get it before next week friday (track time again)

I'll keep everyone informed.

cheers,
x

 

[Hrant]

I refuse to let this thread die.. :tongue:

Me too :biggrin:

Just an update. Yesterday Al and I spent some time going over brake/rotor techs for on coming track events. While doing that, we also inspected the sway bars, Type R brace, battery tray corners, radiator hose ..... and after some six track events, we saw absolutely no signs or scrtach marks in the areas of previous concern. Terpak's solution works.

 

[JoeSchmoe]

Would anyone whose installed the Type-R bars happen to have their old spacers and bolts lying around? By spacer, I mean this thing:

I just installed a set of CT swaybars on a '94 and the bar does not clear the radiator pipe (the one jadkar had to bend). Im hoping the spacers will give it enough clearance.

Please PM me if you have spares lying around. Thanks.

-- Joe

 

[ATERPAK]

I have new custom spacers about 1/2 as thick as that which would work. Send me a check for $20 and I'll have them in the mail to you via Priority mail. Send check to:

Al Terpak
P.O. Box 276212
Sacramento, CA 95827

My complete kit works for all years and there are two different kits depending on the model year cutoff which should be 95. Please remember that if you do have the Type R bracket at the bottom, moving the sway bar closer to it only makes the problem worse. If you only have a sway bar hitting the hose without the Type R kit, then my spacers will do the job.

 

[BioBanker]

Ive got an 02 thats lowered with TODA coilovers (1.5 inches).

Ive got Comptech sway bars AND Type R chassis bars to get put in.

What do I need to make it fit?

PS - this is one of the most amazing threads on PRIME. And that says a lot.

 

[ATERPAK]

You'll need one of my kits to allow for the proper clearance of both the Type R braces and radiator hoses. This kit also allows you to keep your safety spare in it's normal position. All I need to know is the model year. The real cutoff point seems to be from 97 on. Kits for the pre 97's run a $40. For 97+ it will cost $75. This also includes shipping to anywhere in the U.S. I can be PM'ed at [email protected] if you need to make this private. Look at panel #94 for my maililng address. Both kits are in stock right now. Take care.

 

[BioBanker]

Dont need to make this private at all!

Do we know if they'll work on 02+ cars? Ive got an 02 and am not aware of any particular changes that may not make it fit, but Id like to confirm first..

Im in Toronto - shipping included there as well?

 

[ATERPAK]

It's needed for all model years and will work. Nothing has changed in the positioning of the of most of the components for the suspension. In fact the 02 model is more likely to rub because of the change of the safety spare and a move of the lower radiator hose to accomodate it. They lowered the sway bar in the process and the spacer is too large for the type R lower bar. My kit will work. If it doesn't let me know and I'll refund your money when you return it.

 

[ak]

Just an FYI. I installed NA2 TYPE-R front sway bar with the lower chassis bar and lowered the car about an inch. everything fits perfectly as mother Honda designed without making any mods! Additional bonus is that the Type-R sway bar has much better clearance from the radiator hose which used to interfere with my old dali bars.

ak

 

[Meeyatch1]

Just an FYI. I installed NA2 TYPE-R front sway bar with the lower chassis bar and lowered the car about an inch. everything fits perfectly as mother Honda designed without making any mods! Additional bonus is that the Type-R sway bar has much better clearance from the radiator hose which used to interfere with my old dali bars.

ak

Your car is a 1994, correct? So you have both of the Type-R parts for the front with NO fitment issues? Straight bolt on?