Lf-a $225,000!!

[6spdterror]

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=126380?tid=edmunds.il.home.photopanel..1.*

I don't know how much of a "smart" move that might be to price it more than a GT-2 or an F430. If this article holds true....lexus might have it's hands full in that price range.

 

[oscar_driver]

Maybe is like the NSX, not made to make $$$ but if it's a true performer that can outperform the GTR + look really exotic .. some people would buy .. one thing for sure, that car will be super i mean super exclusive.
Oscar

 

[TURBO2GO]

In other words 3X the price of a GTR.

Maybe they know something... maybe the NSX did poorly because it was TOO cheap.

One thing is for sure. Between 69K of the GTR and the 225K of the LF-A, that leaves Honda plenty of space in between.

 

[6spdterror]

In other words 3X the price of a GTR.

Maybe they know something... maybe the NSX did poorly because it was TOO cheap.

One thing is for sure. Between 69K of the GTR and the 225K of the LF-A, that leaves Honda plenty of space in between.

I think the NSX was priced right. High enough to keep it rare and exclusive but low enough to actually sell some of them! People were complaining about the 90k msrp and "only" 290 HP.........imagine the critics if it cost more than 100k and still had 290!

 

[DrVolkl]

That's a tough sell...I mean, I think at that point I'd like a Ferrari.

At some point the performance of the car is going to exceed anything I'm capable of, and then other things come into play...such as looks, price and heritage.

 

[Liquid]

That's a tough sell...I mean, I think at that point I'd like a Ferrari.

Agree. $225k is going to mean they're going to sell NSX-like quantities of them. The Ferrari is 100x the looks, heritage, racing technology, and everything else, and may also still hold the edge in performance (not sure yet).

Keep in mind though that supposedly the pricing of the F430 replacement is going way up when it comes out.

 

[Doc C]

Everybody on here touts Honda reliability as a huge factor when comparing the NSX to Ferrari. What about Toyota reliability vs. Ferrari?? There are many NSXs on here that have 200-300K miles. How many Ferraris have that kind of reliability and durability? The LF-A is going to be an amazing car, no doubt about it. I think fit and finish will easily be better than Ferrari. The 599 GTB is the benchmark for the LF-A and while the 599 has a sticker of $250K, everyone knows you'll never touch one for that amount. If Lexus sells the LF-A for $225K, it will be a bargain over the 599. I love the 599, but I'd choose the dealer availability, and overall reliability and livability of the Lexus over it if the choice was mine. The same reason many chose the NSX over the Ferrari.

Furthermore, if the NSX replacement is the turd that they have shown us, I don't care if they're giving away free puppies with the purchase of one, it won't sell at any price point.

 

[CarCrazed4Life]

@ $225k I wouldn't buy it. At 125k I wouldn't buy it...

I'll wait for Fisker to redo the body on the GT-R

 

[NSXGMS]

Everybody on here touts Honda reliability as a huge factor when comparing the NSX to Ferrari. What about Toyota reliability vs. Ferrari?? There are many NSXs on here that have 200-300K miles. How many Ferraris have that kind of reliability and durability? The LF-A is going to be an amazing car, no doubt about it. I think fit and finish will easily be better than Ferrari. The 599 GTB is the benchmark for the LF-A and while the 599 has a sticker of $250K, everyone knows you'll never touch one for that amount. If Lexus sells the LF-A for $225K, it will be a bargain over the 599. I love the 599, but I'd choose the dealer availability, and overall reliability and livability of the Lexus over it if the choice was mine. The same reason many chose the NSX over the Ferrari.

Furthermore, if the NSX replacement is the turd that they have shown us, I don't care if they're giving away free puppies with the purchase of one, it won't sell at any price point.

Everything you say here is true. Of course the LF-A will be a better car. But people with $225K to spend are simply not going to spend it on a Toyota, relative bargain or not. People who drop that kind of money on a car probably 1) don't drive it much anyway and 2) can afford the constant repairs.

The reasons people chose to buy the NSX were debatable but I think you'll find Ferrari owners and NSX owners in 1991 were quite a different demographic. Remember, the NSX was less than 2/3 the price of the 348 and 1/3 the price of the Testarossa. Plus, the NSX was faster looked better than Ferrari anyway. :tongue:

Pricing this car above $175K is a big mistake for Toyota. The ZR-1 and the GT-R (V-Spec) have shown that for under 100K you can get the world's fastest cars. There's no reason in the world to price the LF-A that high. Lexus cannot compete with the Ferrari, Lambo and Porsche brands and they will find that out the hard way.

I do hope this is a limited production showcase car because Toyota will be very disappointed if they expect a profit.

 

[Timpo]

ok for $225,000, I think a lot of people would just rather have an F430.
but here is the difference...

Nurburgring Laptime:

7:24 Lexus LF-A
7:27 Pagani Zonda F
7:28 Porsche Carrera GT
7:29 Nissan GT-R
7:32 Porsche 911 GT2
7:34 Koenigsegg CCR
7:38 Mercedes-Benz SLR 722 GT
7:40 Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
7:40 Bugatti Veyron
7:42 Porsche 911 GT3
7:42 Ford GT
7:42 Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
7:43 Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
7:44 Pagani Zonda S
7:46 Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera
7:46 Porsche 911 GT2
7:47 Porsche 911 GT3
7:47 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano f1
7:47 Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
7:50 BMW M3 E46 CSL
7:50 BMW X5 E53 LM
7:54 Mercedes CLK DTM AMG
7:55 Caterham R500 Superlight
7:55 Ferrari F430 scuderia F1

also keep in mind that Lexus' fit and finish, durability and reliability will be far better than Ferrari.

 

[NSXGMS]

ok for $225,000, I think a lot of people would just rather have an F430.
but here is the difference...

Nurburgring Laptime:

7:24 Lexus LF-A
7:27 Pagani Zonda F
7:28 Porsche Carrera GT
7:29 Nissan GT-R
7:32 Porsche 911 GT2
7:34 Koenigsegg CCR
7:38 Mercedes-Benz SLR 722 GT
7:40 Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
7:40 Bugatti Veyron
7:42 Porsche 911 GT3
7:42 Ford GT
7:42 Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
7:43 Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
7:44 Pagani Zonda S
7:46 Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera
7:46 Porsche 911 GT2
7:47 Porsche 911 GT3
7:47 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano f1
7:47 Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
7:50 BMW M3 E46 CSL
7:50 BMW X5 E53 LM
7:54 Mercedes CLK DTM AMG
7:55 Caterham R500 Superlight
7:55 Ferrari F430 scuderia F1

also keep in mind that Lexus' fit and finish, durability and reliability will be far better than Ferrari.

Where are you getting that 7:24 time? That is fast but the Spec-V should beat it.

I think the LF-A looks better than the ASCC and the GT-R but it ain't no Ferrari or Lambo.

 

[TyraNSX]

Wow, a repost in the completely wrong forum.

http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105595

 

[PhiAlpha44]

one thing for sure, that car will be super i mean super exclusive.
Oscar

Too bad that doesn't make the car NOT ugly!

 

[Timpo]

Where are you getting that 7:24 time? That is fast but the Spec-V should beat it.

I think the LF-A looks better than the ASCC and the GT-R but it ain't no Ferrari or Lambo.

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/214086/lexus_lfa.html
http://www.autospider.org/index.php...-faster-than-porsche-gt2s-nurburgring-record/

 

[BD]

F430 is only 3 seconds faster than the NSX-R?

 

[JChoice]

Ferrari doesn't do any official testing at Nurburgring- those are times set by a magazine or something. Hardly the fastest time possible given that the GT3 is on there at 7:42.

 

[DrVolkl]

A couple quick points:

Yes, as stated above...if I have $225k to spend on a car, I'm not worried about Toyota quality at that point...I probably wouldn't put 50k miles on my LF-A or my F430. I'd rather have a piece of history...join the "members" club that is Ferrari.

As for Ring track times...who really cares. What's YOUR fastest ring time? Most likely most of us are going to be just as fast in either car...because we're not going to have the skill/balls to push it to 11 to get those extra few seconds.

What's important is how you feel driving it on the weekend, out in the country, or that occasional track day.

Lexus generally does fairly little to stir one's soul...(at least not yet...that may be changing) the original pics of this car looked fairly promising, but the latest pictures look pretty lame. Add a price north of $200k and I'm out.

Lets also not forget that this is Toyota's first attempt at a super car. If you read the reviews of the IS-F vs the M3 and AMG, you'll see there's more to it than simply building a fast car. There's a lot of learning along the way.

 

[MAJOR STONER]

Toyota Camery $27,530 268HP 6.1/14.5 sec.
Acura TL Type-S $38,795 286HP 5.7/14.3 sec.

Acura peak HP 1995=290
Acura peak HP 2009=300

 

[shrddr]

Maybe they know something... maybe the NSX did poorly because it was TOO cheap.

One thing is for sure. Between 69K of the GTR and the 225K of the LF-A, that leaves Honda plenty of space in between.

the NSX did not do poorly because it was too cheap. it did poorly because:

- at that time (and through the years really) acura has not done enough to distance itself from honda and make itself stand out as a luxury/sports brand.
- the asking price in 1991 may have been fair... but in 2005 you simply weren't getting enough car (in the common person's eyes... not for us enthusiasts) for the money.

your last sentence really says it all. "plenty of space for honda in between"? NO. there *could* have been space for ACURA in between... but acura is still too closely associated with honda. lexus has done a FAR better job of making its brand distinct from toyota.

 

[shrddr]

That's a tough sell...I mean, I think at that point I'd like a Ferrari.

At some point the performance of the car is going to exceed anything I'm capable of, and then other things come into play...such as looks, price and heritage.

this the exact same logic that ferrari fans use when they say ferrari > nsx... folks on this forum get all riled up about that... but apparently it is ok when used against other cars.

 

[shrddr]

Lets also not forget that this is Toyota's first attempt at a super car. If you read the reviews of the IS-F vs the M3 and AMG, you'll see there's more to it than simply building a fast car. There's a lot of learning along the way.

let's also not forget that the NSX was honda's first attempt at a supercar. and they did a pretty fine job of it wouldn't you say

 

[Silver F16]

AT $200K, Toyota will sell 200 - 100 units a year. At that price point, an establish name plate goes further than the actual product. Hate to say that but it is quite true. Granted NSX was no where near $200K, but the marque factor came into play hence the limited sales volume of the NSX.

'm surprised at the fast 7:24 lap time. Perhaps I'm still in disbelief that Toyota could make a decent sports car after owning one of their sports sedan and also having tracked the IS-F. For me, Honda first exotic is still a bigger breakthrough than this Toyota. Yea, it fast, but like typical toyota / Lexus products, you won't feel a damn thing in that Lexus isolation chamber. For that, I'll never care how fast it goes if I cannot be one with the car.

 

[oscar_driver]

the NSX did not do poorly because it was too cheap. it did poorly because:

- at that time (and through the years really) acura has not done enough to distance itself from honda and make itself stand out as a luxury/sports brand........

Honda Did poorly not because it was a "honda" they had good NSX sales on the begin, but unlike most serious sportscars manufacturers (ex. porsche always upgraded 911 and 3 different F-cars on the same time period) Honda (yes honda) didn't do anything to improve HP or make a "special" track edition of the NSX (untill 97 not really any changes unless the 3.2 extra 20HP and Zanardy edition, nice cars but way .. wayyyy less of what the buyers paying 85K could ask or expect) yes, there's Type-R in Japan, but still, instead taking this marvelous platform and give a FI version or a BAD ASS V8 (they know how to make V8's for racing or even taking 2 F20C's and make a V8 out of it) honda, nope, ignores it's customers request/hopes and let their great cars on the corner getting dust, the S2000 is the same thing, after all HYPE for the --"in a track near you"-- CR we had a revamp S2000 (ap2) with basic mods that most people can do themselves, no extra FI HP (based on the F22 been maxed) ....

If Honda NEVER upgrades/improves drastically their only sportscars (whoa we only have the old aging S2k now) then this generation of buyers will move to even Chevy, but i guess they don't care too much, they are selling in record numbers (although this last quarter wasn't that good) but still .. honda will only try hard if they need to get their reputation back, they did an awesome job on the 80's on F1 .... but by judging on the latest FWD TSX and GRILLE monsters TL and RL and gigantic Accords honda will turn into the oldsmobile from Japan ...

I don't expect no more, i will be happy with my S2k and FI NSX on my garage, i am over 30 anyways.

my 0.2

Oscar

 

[DrVolkl]

this the exact same logic that ferrari fans use when they say ferrari > nsx... folks on this forum get all riled up about that... but apparently it is ok when used against other cars.

Last time I checked the NSX didn't cost $200+K...and if it did, I'd expect a lot more from it.

Ferrari's aren't nearly as unreliable as they used to be...the niche that the NSX filled in 1991 is no longer there. I'm not sure what Lexus is really bringing to the table.

If they could have done it for $100 to 150k, then I'd get it...as it stands now, I don't.

 

[navyflydoc]

ok for $225,000, I think a lot of people would just rather have an F430.
but here is the difference...

Nurburgring Laptime:

7:24 Lexus LF-A
7:27 Pagani Zonda F
7:28 Porsche Carrera GT
7:29 Nissan GT-R
7:32 Porsche 911 GT2
7:34 Koenigsegg CCR
7:38 Mercedes-Benz SLR 722 GT
7:40 Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren
7:40 Bugatti Veyron
7:42 Porsche 911 GT3
7:42 Ford GT
7:42 Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06
7:43 Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
7:44 Pagani Zonda S
7:46 Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera
7:46 Porsche 911 GT2
7:47 Porsche 911 GT3
7:47 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano f1
7:47 Lamborghini Murcielago LP640
7:50 BMW M3 E46 CSL
7:50 BMW X5 E53 LM
7:54 Mercedes CLK DTM AMG
7:55 Caterham R500 Superlight
7:55 Ferrari F430 scuderia F1

also keep in mind that Lexus' fit and finish, durability and reliability will be far better than Ferrari.

Does this world really need another bloated luxury "Supercar" ? The more I analyze this situation, the more I appreciate and lust for this simple yet elegant toxic Honda powered beauty http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0ieELygQPE&NR=1