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SynergyAutoworks vs evof575gtc
- Thread starter Rogue MotorSports
- Start date
My guess would Erick, Demigod, octechgeek, and who ever owns this orange nsx
KooLaid,
Your guess was wrong! I'm the owner of this Orange in this pic and I don't have anything to do with Mode4. Please make an intelligent guess next time!
"Assumption is the mother of all ............."
it was an intelligent guess. Your car seems to pop up all the time where ever when ever Erick's does in pictures. So why not?
No need to get pissy. It was just a guess, and a rather nice set of cars. No reason to get all "so cal" on my ass lol
hey Koo
edit your post! or you will be "infacted" too!:biggrin:
u can't put "AXX"in your post
oh ......wait, you paid! nevermind
People like you should be banned from this site.
All you do is instigate and finger pointing. Bring your hatred else where.
[/B]
He isnt adding fuel to fire just by stating facts.
Fact- THEY ARE NO ROBIN HOODS IN PRIME JUST PEOPLE WHO WANT TO MAKE SOME $..
You finding a need to kiss arse every chance you get to make and keep few friends is pretty disgusting. Even after you see the price difference you think this guy doesn't have a right to complain/vent/throw in his 2 cents?
Did YOU even buy this product?
So you are one of those people YOU were talking about that throw thier 2 cents in when they are not even planing on buying anything in the first place.
OMG Yay, you really have lost it.
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drama queens..... get a life and move on. people always whine and complain about everything here on prime. damm i swear... save the drama fo' yo' mama!!!!!
- Joined
- 7 April 2006
- Messages
- 420
Welcome to the new vendor. I could care less about Mode4 and if they were ripping off Prime members. The bottom line is, we're all being offered a product that is similar in quality/fit&finish for a much lower price. Hope you guys bring more goodies to Prime members.
On another note, some people here are too trusting of others after just a few exchanges. Just because we share a similar interest doesn't mean that everyone here is honest/trustworthy. There's one person who is a total crook, and despite a few posts made about this person, Prime members continue to give him "kudos" and claim he's a "stand up guy" just because of previous exchanges (he is a long-time member).
Hope to see more items that currently priced in the high-end be created and offered at more reasonable prices.
On another note, some people here are too trusting of others after just a few exchanges. Just because we share a similar interest doesn't mean that everyone here is honest/trustworthy. There's one person who is a total crook, and despite a few posts made about this person, Prime members continue to give him "kudos" and claim he's a "stand up guy" just because of previous exchanges (he is a long-time member).
Hope to see more items that currently priced in the high-end be created and offered at more reasonable prices.
Yay does have a valid point though in the midst of all the random finger pointing and accusations.
If you have read the entire fiasco, you will understand the true crook is the owner of NRG. Mode4 paid for every thing to get project going and behind their back, they produced more than what was agreed and decided to find some one to move the product at a post development cost - after they sat on the product for months.
They lied to these kids from Synergy with a made up story to make Mode4 look bad and and decline to release the mold even though it was paid in full by Mode4, and now he is trying to hurt the very people who took care of the true cost of this project.
FYI, NRG does not have any other NSX specific product other than this diffuser. If they have other NSX related product, it will be made by other venders. NRG no longer have the trust of any legit investors who is interested to have NSX parts made through them. Judging by their business conduct and rumor through the grapevine, they may not even be around some times in the future. The practice of liquidation by dumping these diffuser at below true cost/value is no more than their attempt to bring back cash flow so they can keep what ever little life line they have longer.
NRG at one point, was a stand up company. I own some of their product and I enjoyed using them... Sorry to see them drop to this level.
I guess it is the way things are. Lots of people are hurting for money right now and unfortunately, most of them don't foresee the potential consequence out of desperate actions.
It is also sad to see some of the Prime member treating this so called "huge" mark up in a unreasonable fashion.
The best example can probably be reflected based on how people who view computer software. Why should we have to pay $400 plus for Microsoft Office when it is just printed on a 20 cent disc? Why? because the cost to get the software developed to that 20 cents disc is included in the price, which is a lot more than 20 cents.
Imagine a manufacture who is printing the software for Microsoft decided to sale the software without their permission for two bucks and tell the world that the software is a rip off at $400 because it "only" cost them 20 cents to print the installation disc. That my friends, under the US judicial system, is a criminal act. Of course, people will still line up to buy them because it is "cheap." I still remember all those kids downloaded thousands of songs through the Internet because "why pay money for some thing that can be obtain for nothing." It was actually funny to hear the story of FBI knocking on their doors.
What made this event even more intriguing is the fact that the Synergy boys totally bought the story NRG gave them and preaching to this community. Than again, youth can be the biggest enemy for beginning entrepreneurs; lack of retail experience and gullible mind can be easily manipulated.
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Probably because of your personal information:
Biography:
I LOVE to stir the pot, rock the boat, walk the line, poke people with a stick
Have too much time on your hand?
- Joined
- 7 April 2006
- Messages
- 420
As I've said, I could care less about who to blame for the current issues. If these guys can produce good quality products for NSX owners, I'm happy to welcome them here.
I don't believe your example really applies here. Software has a lot of development costs. From what Synergy is saying, there were no upfront costs for Mode4. I think a more appropriate example would be some Chinese knockoff company making a Prada-copy "Prava"-branded bag - the knockoff is good quality. People ask why they have to spend $xxx on this bag, even though the Chinese factory produced it for $xx. It's priced $xxx because the alternative (genuine product) is $x,xxx.
Probably because of your personal information:
Biography:
I LOVE to stir the pot, rock the boat, walk the line, poke people with a stick
Have too much time on your hand?
Sounds like a personal attack.. besides, who has more time on their hands? The person who makes a guess or the person who looks up that person's profile?
- Joined
- 14 September 2006
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- 1,725
I'd agree with you on the software analogy except for one minor detail: Mode4 wouldn't be analogous to Microsoft--they'd be analogous to someone who copied Microsoft's OS. Honda would be analogous to Microsoft, as they are the ones who put in the real R&D for this product. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but the Mode4 diffuser--which was manufactured by NRG--was a copy of an OEM Honda NSX-R diffuser. So to say mode4 was the victim of pirating wouldn't be accurate. Actually, Mode4 spearheaded the pirating of a Honda part to be manufactured by NRG.
To complete the analogy, it would be if Company M took Microsoft's OS; asked a team of engineers to copy it; sold the copied version to the public under their own name at $(x+profit); the engineers then sold copies of the copied OS to another company S; Company S sells the same copied OS to the public at $(x + substantially less profit); Company M gets mad at Company S and reduces their price of the product.
It seems to me that the issue at hand is what the deal was between the engineers and company M. Only those two know the real story. You can't really blame Company S or anyone else. As for legal recourse against Company S, personally I don't think there is much action you can take as they haven't really broken any laws. You might get NRG for breech of contract, but that is about it.
I haven't had any experience with Synergy or NRG, but I've met Eric before and he seems like a good guy. Hopefully this all gets resolved.
- Joined
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- 110
nah they have 4 involved. find one more and well 5v5 counterstrike.
ex cali in the house!
As I have indicated, people will line up to buy stuff because it's cheap. Regardless what the thoughts are, you now have a Diffuser in CF at a give away price, take advantage of it and get one, because NRG and Synergyxxx will most likely, not have any thing else for the NSX in the future, at least not any thing they will produce them self. As I have indicated, this is a one shot wonder, a deal of a life time.
Dude, I bought the Procar NSX-R diffuser two years ago, and I'm out there talking crap about Procar? absolutely not. After dealing with Downforce for couple of years, I came to understand this type of business, I can honestly say that who ever want to make a product, replica or not, some one has to pick up the initial cost. As I have indicated on my previous threads, Mode4 got the raw end of the deal, and it is an unfortunate event. They have some cool NSX stuff in their pipeline and some one else will be producing their future product, some one who will honor their contract.
BTW, I was making a "intelligent" guess regarding Koolaid's comment, after reading his Bio. No personal attack here
The scenario is similar. Mode4 purchased a real deal, consulted NRG to produce the product, paid for the mold and initial production run. NRG decided to make more than the agreement and flood the market against the very people who paid for project. A conflict of interest maybe?
As for your comment regarding replicated parts, there has always been an unwritten rule in this industry. You can copy what ever your can see or touch, but you can't steal the blue print from the technology proprietor's computer and benefit from it (McLaren vs. Ferrari, 2007 F1 season), but that's an entirely different matter. What I can tell you is, there are companies out there that have replicated this product such as Procar, DF, KITE garage, Mode4, etc. with price range of $175 to over $1000 (depend on the exchange rate). Honda will never go after them.
Regardless, here is a simple fact. I'm not involve with Mode4, but I am a friend with Peter/Downforce. In S. Cal, once you learn one company, you will learn more about other closely associated companies. NRG is only 10 minutes away from DF and I have been there before. There are more dirt regarding NRG to this story than what Synergy understand and Mode4 is willing disclose. In a way, it is a good thing because as a consumer, we don't really need to know the dirt unless some one stir it up. In this case, people can buy the diffuser below the true cost - Consumer is the benefactor. After spoken to the owner of Mode4, he basically decided to let this one go and take a financial lost on this matter; at the same time, NRG has lost a good customer who put their very trust in NRG as supposedly, a legit and honorable company.
Erick of Mode4 has been a stand up guy. When entered this community for the first time, I conducted business with him as one of my first vender, he has never failed me. I'll give you a good example. Two years ago when he installed my NRG quick release hub for my NSX-R steering wheel, I ran into a problem with the horn. It will go off when I turn my steering wheel. Erick show up at my shop at 3 am and fixed the problem without complaint so I don't have to leave my car by my shop - He had class at 8 am!!! The problem turn out to be not related to his installation. He didn't charge me any money, took care of the problem, supplied me with additional parts that he was not obligated to at no charge, and that was the end of the transaction. That to me, is not only great customer service, but some one who is willing to back up the stuff he sales, and some one who cares about his customers by offering superior customer service. That is why every time some on PM me for information, and trust me, I get them almost daily, I often recommended Erick of Mode4 if his service fits the bill. You can't find a more stand up guy in this community than Erick.
In my opinion, NRG has lost more potential future earnings because Mode4 have some really cool NSX related project in their pipeline. Obviously, NRG will no longer get any more contract due to this unfortunate event. NRG decided to pull a fast one so they can dump some insignificant inventory that were produced in violation of the contract, all for the sake of some cash during this economic hard time. As I have indicated, time has been tough for some companies, and many don't survive, even after some desperate attempt. In this case, many business owners will tell you that we don't always make good money, some times we have to juggle the money pertty hard in order to pass the difficult periods. It's the way we juggle the money separate different business from been a good vender or bad.
Consumers has to make the decision of who to buy/support. I have always supported good venders on Prime by offering them my business. In most cases, I could have gotten better prices by purchased through other venders, but I like to see good companies thrive by not only offer the community more great future products that is unique to us, and willing to stand up for their products. How often have we see venders who came on Prime and pulled a fast one, run with the money, and never be heard again? Deamon, Tomaske, etc?
The most unfortunate part of this event is the fact that the discussion is played out in Public. As for some of those who questioned the true cost of the this product, as any small business owners will tell you, the 100% true cost will never be calculated. The money and time you spend by going to SEMA, negotiate with the manufacture, first initial cost to cast the mold, and first production run, etc. etc. As of this moment, both both sides has lost great amount of time and resources arguing over some thing that absolutely shouldn't have happened. Have you ever heard "some one will sell his mother for a pitiful dollar if he can?" In essence, NRG basically did just that.
In a few months, few will remember this incident. Mode4 will move on and life will be back to normal. Mode4 will have some more cool stuff to offer, some thing other venders will not have.
As for the members of the community who believe this is a great way to get parts cheap, Analyze what I just wrote. Of course some will agree, and some wouldn't. It's OK, we are all entitle to our opinions.
Peace out, I got my 2 cents in and I'm done with this thread.
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- Joined
- 7 March 2008
- Messages
- 175
Wow, we get an entirely to long post from Vancehu that has no actual meaning to it. You keep saying that MODE 4 paid for this and paid for that, that is absolutely not true. They did not pay for the mold, they did not pay for anything besides the actual oem diffuser. You keep talking down about NRG, but when i read your posts it seems to be missing many many actual facts. I was completely honost upfront and posted to the entirity of my knowledge. Why hasnt mode 4 made it clear. The simply shifted the the blame from US at synergy to NRG.
To try and summarize the cost for you all. We went to NRG, they do not charge us any mold fees, no labor cost, nothing. We provide them with a part to be replicated, in order to do it they require that we purchase x number of them at $y. Once that agreement is made, they start production. But if only x-30 products are purchased, where does the manufacture go from there, if we do not purchase the other 30 pieces like we said we were going to, he has to get rid of them somehow.
And your comments about us being a 1 hit wonder. Only time will truly tell, but i can tell you that we have 2 more cf nsx-r piece coming in very very soon.
Once again NRG is not the bad guys. They had extra product, that the original purchaser agreed to purchase, but never did. If you have ever purchased a NRG product you will notice it is top notch, and of the highest quality. If you ever needed assistance from they, you will notice they go out of there way to provide the highest level of customer servive.
We have been completely honost and upfront to you guys here, but we are only getting bits and pieces of stories from mode 4 and its followers. Its hard for me to weed through there and determine whats fact from fiction.
To try and summarize the cost for you all. We went to NRG, they do not charge us any mold fees, no labor cost, nothing. We provide them with a part to be replicated, in order to do it they require that we purchase x number of them at $y. Once that agreement is made, they start production. But if only x-30 products are purchased, where does the manufacture go from there, if we do not purchase the other 30 pieces like we said we were going to, he has to get rid of them somehow.
And your comments about us being a 1 hit wonder. Only time will truly tell, but i can tell you that we have 2 more cf nsx-r piece coming in very very soon.
Once again NRG is not the bad guys. They had extra product, that the original purchaser agreed to purchase, but never did. If you have ever purchased a NRG product you will notice it is top notch, and of the highest quality. If you ever needed assistance from they, you will notice they go out of there way to provide the highest level of customer servive.
We have been completely honost and upfront to you guys here, but we are only getting bits and pieces of stories from mode 4 and its followers. Its hard for me to weed through there and determine whats fact from fiction.
I don't think anybody doubts that you've been honest about what took place between you and NRG, but you must recognize that you're taking the word of an NRG employee as fACT. As you noted above "the entirety of my knowledge".
Are you saying that what MODE4 has gone through doesn't ever happen in these types of situations?
Its simple... MODE4 needed a signed contract and none of this would be happening. Instead NRG realized that with no contract in place they could strong-arm MODE4 into buying more than requested. With MODE4 having an exclusive rights agreement (verbal) they refuse to be "shookdown" and so NRG sells off the product to someone else.
What NRG attemted is commonly referred to as a "Shakedown". That being said MODE4 most def should have had a written contract.
My 2 cents.
You are right about the finger pointing and accusations, but I'd say his point being valid could be up for debate. :smile:
I guess the truth will come out when Mode4 files a lawsuit against NRG right?
NOT TRUE
Probably because of your personal information:
Biography:
I LOVE to stir the pot, rock the boat, walk the line, poke people with a stick
Have too much time on your hand?
It's true. I do have too much time on my hands. I'd drive my car more, and be here alot less if the drive to someplace interesting was MUCH closer. More than likely, I'd be at your shop smoking some hookah..... seriously.
BTW, I was making a "intelligent" guess regarding Koolaid's comment, after reading his Bio. No personal attack here
Oh I wasn't worried. It's "personal" information, but not PERSONAL information if you know what I mean. If I didn't want someone to know something about myself, I wouldn't have openly posted it up for the world. I am rather honored Vance would take the time to look me up, lol.
Agreed. However it's not his customer support that people are making an issue over. Though there have been some issues about CS to those who are not in So Cal but eventually were taken care of.
Until someone makes a "replica" of it.
My thought is, WHY DIDN'T THEY GET A WRITTEN CONTRACT? I found that highly unusual in today's day and age, especially in california, ESPECIALLY in southern california. When thousands of dollars are on the line, a man hug isn't going to seal the deal enough to recoup those large amounts of money. EXTREMELY odd.
Maybe I've watched a few too many episodes of Judge Judy or something but doesn't even a verbal contract hold some water?
Maybe you do watch too much Judge Judy :tongue: , or maybe you haven't had a lot of exposure to the manufacturing business.
I agree that in today's day and age nothing exists unless its on paper, but business on a smaller scale such as making less than 100 or so products for a small market is often done in a less formal matter based on trust (esp. if you have worked w/ that manufacturer in the past w/ positive results). So, its not as unusual as you think.
Sad to see things unfold this way, but it is what it is.
What I find unusual, for Prime anyway, is one vendor starting a vs. thread against another vendor as a way to promote the sale of their offer. Now, that is unusual and unprofessional for our community.
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Spent years in manufacturing but just the engineering side.
Well the thread doesn't seem to have been started as a compare or contrast issue. It was created on the basis that there is/was an issue between synergy and evo/mode4 like a fight or battle. Not "why we're good and they suck". However in both instances, "vs" can be used for both. It's the content written by synergy in this thread however, that tells you it's not a compare/contrast issue. I feel they did very well in representing their side and Mode4 also did, both doing so LATER ON. Both sides might of reacted in a bad manner in front of the camera and behind the camera though.
baynsac
Guest
VANCE again not being involved but thinks he knows whats going on. If you are not part of mode4 how the hell do you know what happened?
And why do you keep saying that this company wont be around ? Just because they are not cool with the So Cal musketeers?
And how do YOU know if they are going to produce more products for the NSX or won't be able to ?
And why do you keep saying that this company wont be around ? Just because they are not cool with the So Cal musketeers?
And how do YOU know if they are going to produce more products for the NSX or won't be able to ?
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