Type S Suspension Thoughts

[jmarksnsx]

I am looking for input from those who have or have driven the factory Type S suspension. I contacted SOS today and it is still available for order. Are they the only ones who import them? Reason for upgrade. I have new Volk CE28N's inbound from Japan. Based on this I am looking at a couple of options to slightly drop the car but mainly to upgrade the shocks etc. The Zanardi suspension is NLA from Acura dealers. I checked with Tim last week.

Bilstein on lower perch with OEM springs 7/8" drop fixed

KW V3 .8 front drop .9 rear drop minimum Linear springs

Type S .6 front drop .3 rear drop fixed Linear springs?

I can find plenty of info on the Bilstein & KW V3 here but not much about the Type S. Cost wise the Bilsteins are the cheapest with the other two options real close in cost. Thoughts?

 

[Stephen@NCAutoUSA]

I personally love the adjustability of the kw's. If you change your mind as much as me and are indecisive then coilovers are the way to go.

If you don't really want to mess with things a nice shock and spring setup is a safe bet, but then again I haven't touched my coilovers since install really and don't plan to change the settings.

I went from bilsteins with tanabe springs to kw clubsports btw. If budget is no concern I'd say a decent set of coilovers no contest, but for the price you can't beat the ride quality and warranty of bilsteins.

 

[docjohn]

The zanardi springs are the same..the shocks are the key..but I had plenty or fun with the zanardi koni yellow combo for less $..

 

[Ira]

Hey jmarksnsx,

Hopefully I'll have some information that you find useful. Brief background, I've had a 2006 s2000, followed by an s2000 CR (completely revised suspension, re valved, damping, increased spring rates) and also added the KWv3's to the CR, subsequently going back to the OEM CR suspension. The OEM CR suspension was pretty stiff, slightly jarring, but handled absolutely beautifully. I loved how they responded to driver input. Having the KW's were extremely refined but I never felt the same response and to be completely honest, I didn't enjoy tuning frequently to get them to the same spot the OEM felt, just at a lower ride height.

Like many of us, I dreamed of an NSX for years. I'd driven all the trim levels and knew something I really missed in transitioning would be the rigidity and suspension of the s2000 if I ever got an NSX (Knowing I'd only end up with a NSX-T) Fast forward, I found my dream car, a 2002 Long Beach Blue Pearl and I knew the one change I wanted to do was suspension. I debated quite a while on what I wanted to do. I had the mindset of keeping the car as OEM as possible but I did miss the feel of the s2000 CR. After talking to quite a few people and some independent research, I went with the 2002+ OEM Type S Suspension from the Japanese Type S, which is what SOS sells.

Ultimately mine did come from SOS, however in doing my research, what I found was the suspension "kit" is no longer offered by Honda of Japan. I don't know the truth on this, but apparently some NSX parts in various warehouses were lost during the Tsunami. The individual components can still be purchased albeit separate (strut, spring, top hat etc). After learning about the Type S revisions for 2002+, I knew that was what I wanted. I imagine SOS had purchased the Type S kit in bulk years ago and has just been selling from their inventory.

On to the review; they are perfect for what I wanted. Something to stiffen the car up some, response, and no hassles with adjusting all along keeping OEM reliability. The drop is more than a half inch, but it wouldn't go as far as saying it's an inch lower. You get a lot of "is your car lowered? I can't tell" It's subtle but enough to notice. The handling is improved substantially. I LOVE the feel. It's very similar to the CR suspension in feel and responsiveness without the rock hard feel of the 2002 Type R suspension. The ride is noticeably different as well, it is more rigid, not as soft as the OEM obviously but to me, this is nowhere near a draw back.

This review from 2008 was helpful as well; http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/103308-installed-my-new-Type-S-suspension

I've attached some photos to show the car's current ride height as well. If you have any specific questions, I'd be happy to go more in depth.

 

[solidol]

Another thing to consider is how easy it is to rebuild or replace blown shock. With bilsteins and kw it's not a problem at all. With type s I guess you would have to go to independent shop for rebuild. What kind of warranty SOS gives on type s suspension?

 

[jmarksnsx]

Hey jmarksnsx,

Hopefully I'll have some information that you find useful. Brief background, I've had a 2006 s2000, followed by an s2000 CR (completely revised suspension, re valved, damping, increased spring rates) and also added the KWv3's to the CR, subsequently going back to the OEM CR suspension. The OEM CR suspension was pretty stiff, slightly jarring, but handled absolutely beautifully. I loved how they responded to driver input. Having the KW's were extremely refined but I never felt the same response and to be completely honest, I didn't enjoy tuning frequently to get them to the same spot the OEM felt, just at a lower ride height.

Like many of us, I dreamed of an NSX for years. I'd driven all the trim levels and knew something I really missed in transitioning would be the rigidity and suspension of the s2000 if I ever got an NSX (Knowing I'd only end up with a NSX-T) Fast forward, I found my dream car, a 2002 Long Beach Blue Pearl and I knew the one change I wanted to do was suspension. I debated quite a while on what I wanted to do. I had the mindset of keeping the car as OEM as possible but I did miss the feel of the s2000 CR. After talking to quite a few people and some independent research, I went with the 2002+ OEM Type S Suspension from the Japanese Type S, which is what SOS sells.

Ultimately mine did come from SOS, however in doing my research, what I found was the suspension "kit" is no longer offered by Honda of Japan. I don't know the truth on this, but apparently some NSX parts in various warehouses were lost during the Tsunami. The individual components can still be purchased albeit separate (strut, spring, top hat etc). After learning about the Type S revisions for 2002+, I knew that was what I wanted. I imagine SOS had purchased the Type S kit in bulk years ago and has just been selling from their inventory.

On to the review; they are perfect for what I wanted. Something to stiffen the car up some, response, and no hassles with adjusting all along keeping OEM reliability. The drop is more than a half inch, but it wouldn't go as far as saying it's an inch lower. You get a lot of "is your car lowered? I can't tell" It's subtle but enough to notice. The handling is improved substantially. I LOVE the feel. It's very similar to the CR suspension in feel and responsiveness without the rock hard feel of the 2002 Type R suspension. The ride is noticeably different as well, it is more rigid, not as soft as the OEM obviously but to me, this is nowhere near a draw back.

This review from 2008 was helpful as well; http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/103308-installed-my-new-Type-S-suspension

I've attached some photos to show the car's current ride height as well. If you have any specific questions, I'd be happy to go more in depth.

Thanks Ira. Your car is beautiful. I like that it is a Targa as well. I had read some comments that the Targa wouldn't take to the stiffer suspension as well as a coupe. I suspect that the Type S components are readily available in Japan as there seems to be a large NSX following there. SOS says that kit is 8 weeks out after purchase which tells me it is coming from Japan. They don't keep it in stock. Based on the cost in Yen it seems SOS charges a premium for the suspension. I am checking a couple of sources before placing an order with SOS. I personally don't want to have to fiddle with the car after installation and the KW V3's may actually lower the car too much for me. Your cars drop looks just about perfect to me and should look good with my new CE28N's. As far as the Bilstein's go I keep reading about noise from the perch area squeaking over bumps etc. I have owned a couple of S2000's, Nismo 350Z & my daily driver is a 2009 Honda Civic Si so I am OK with a firm ride.

 

[Ira]

Thanks Mark! Good to hear about the parts info, whatever you end up with, be sure to post a review! Would love to hear how it turns out.

Ira

 

[naaman]

I got to ride in an NSX with the Type-R suspension. I actually thought the ride quality was quite nice considering how flat it cornered (it seemed to have zero roll whatsoever). I've wondered I would think that the Type-S was "stiff" enough, but a read through this thread makes me think the Type S might be worth consideration.

 

[Honcho]

I have driven stock, Type-S and NSX-R. The NSX-R is remarkably smooth and feels softer over rough roads than the Type-S, which is strange given the higher spring rates. That said, the Type-S is a fabulous suspension and virtually perfect in terms of handling balance (I recommend you also use the Zanardi sway bars with it to get the full effect). However, I think it is too harsh for a daily driver- the one I drove was nasty over rough roads and highway joints knocked the wheel out of my hands. Dollar for dollar, however, the KW outclasses both of them. It rides better and out-handles the NSX-R or Type-S. The KW gives you Moton/JRZ performance for Type-S money.

 

[jmarksnsx]

I have driven stock, Type-S and NSX-R. The NSX-R is remarkably smooth and feels softer over rough roads than the Type-S, which is strange given the higher spring rates. That said, the Type-S is a fabulous suspension and virtually perfect in terms of handling balance (I recommend you also use the Zanardi sway bars with it to get the full effect). However, I think it is too harsh for a daily driver- the one I drove was nasty over rough roads and highway joints knocked the wheel out of my hands. Dollar for dollar, however, the KW outclasses both of them. It rides better and out-handles the NSX-R or Type-S. The KW gives you Moton/JRZ performance for Type-S money.

Thanks. I am curious what suspension you have on your NSX now. As far as picking up a Type S suspension it may be a mute point. I placed an order with SOS after being told it was still available for order last week. Got an email from them Monday saying they weren't sure if they could fill the order after all and if they could not sure how much it would cost. I was not happy. I called and cancelled the order. I have A.S. Motorsport looking into the Type S suspension as well. If that doesn't pan out I may be forced to go the KW V3 route.

 

[Honcho]

Thanks. I am curious what suspension you have on your NSX now. As far as picking up a Type S suspension it may be a mute point. I placed an order with SOS after being told it was still available for order last week. Got an email from them Monday saying they weren't sure if they could fill the order after all and if they could not sure how much it would cost. I was not happy. I called and cancelled the order. I have A.S. Motorsport looking into the Type S suspension as well. If that doesn't pan out I may be forced to go the KW V3 route.

Honestly, for the money you will like the KW much more. It just does everything so much better than the factory offerings. I have the BC Racing system with Swift springs (NSX_R rates) on my car and love it. If I tracked more I would have KW. You can read about the BC system at my review here:

http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/159029-BC-Racing-Coilovers-Comprehensive-Review

 

[jmarksnsx]

Honestly, for the money you will like the KW much more. It just does everything so much better than the factory offerings. I have the BC Racing system with Swift springs (NSX_R rates) on my car and love it. If I tracked more I would have KW. You can read about the BC system at my review here:

http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/159029-BC-Racing-Coilovers-Comprehensive-Review

I find it interesting that you started out looking for a Type S setup as well. Back in 2012 I would have thought it would have been fairly easy to buy.

 

[Honcho]

Yeah, but back then a used Type-S was going for around $1,800. Now, it is KW money and at that price point, I would choose the KW every time.

 

[RYU]

I have driven stock, Type-S and NSX-R. The NSX-R is remarkably smooth and feels softer over rough roads than the Type-S, which is strange given the higher spring rates. That said, the Type-S is a fabulous suspension and virtually perfect in terms of handling balance (I recommend you also use the Zanardi sway bars with it to get the full effect). However, I think it is too harsh for a daily driver- the one I drove was nasty over rough roads and highway joints knocked the wheel out of my hands. Dollar for dollar, however, the KW outclasses both of them. It rides better and out-handles the NSX-R or Type-S. The KW gives you Moton/JRZ performance for Type-S money.

I will have to respectfully disagree my dear friend! I've had a few thousand miles on the JRZs and damn son. It is extremely sophisticated. Not saying the KWs are bad. Just don't feel they are in the same league.

I guess ignorance is bliss. Until recently, I would have been first to say the JRZs weren't worth the money. Now I feel they're worth every penny and more. Again, ignorance is bliss. I would have probably been perfectly happy with my life w/o them but from this point forward high end dampers is a must for every performance car I own. It's like a drug. I just want to drive my car ALL THE TIME.

 

[Honcho]

No problem, Regan. You have a better reference point than me. I only drove a JRZ-equipped NSX a few miles and under sedate conditions, so I couldn't really tell. It was very comfortable and responsive, but the KW felt the same to me under those circumstance. Both felt better than my BC's however. I my go JRZ RS when my BC's die, but even with this horrible winter we're having, they just keep on truckin!

 

[RYU]

I'll be the first to admit my butt dyno isn't highly calibrated like some others on here. My opinion is worth maybe 1 grain of salt.

 

[jmarksnsx]

Any issues with KW V3 warranty claims? I have read some horror stories. I know they have a lifetime warranty to the buyer.

 

[Honcho]

Any issues with KW V3 warranty claims? I have read some horror stories. I know they have a lifetime warranty to the buyer.

Maybe a KW owner will chime in? For street only NSX, the BC system has proven to be one of the best options. I've driven the heck out of these coilovers on street and track, including today to work when it is is -2 F outside and 2 inches of snow on the roads, mag chloride, sand, grit. They just keep working. I rinse them off after a snowstorm and not a mark or spec on them. This is their 3rd winter. Just sayin.

 

[jmarksnsx]

Still waiting to hear on the Type S suspension kit. I was reading this thread about the minimum KW V3 drop which is minimum .8 front .9 rear.

http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showt...-suspension-drop/page2?highlight=zanardi+drop

Wouldn't you have to drop the KW V3 fronts even more to keep the proper rake from front to back? Not sure I want to do that.

 

[Stephen@NCAutoUSA]

I think like many things online and in life you're over complicating things...

Although coilovers you need to set, if set up correctly you won't need to change them. There's plenty of owners that have had them installed and haven't touched a thing.

The proper rake and ideal rake has been discussed before and it's 1/8-1/4 front to back. Meaning the front is slightly lower compared to the rear. Measuring on a level surface is critical "like an alignment rack" since the ground will have slight differences.

I say if you have the money get kW 's. They are more advanced then mostly everyone can handle except maybe a select few that actually race for a living. Or a coilover system. My kw clubsports are the first coilover system I've owned. I can say I wish I had coilovers on every car just because of the adjustability of height, dampening, and compression.

 

[jmarksnsx]

I have driven stock, Type-S and NSX-R. The NSX-R is remarkably smooth and feels softer over rough roads than the Type-S, which is strange given the higher spring rates. That said, the Type-S is a fabulous suspension and virtually perfect in terms of handling balance (I recommend you also use the Zanardi sway bars with it to get the full effect). However, I think it is too harsh for a daily driver- the one I drove was nasty over rough roads and highway joints knocked the wheel out of my hands. Dollar for dollar, however, the KW outclasses both of them. It rides better and out-handles the NSX-R or Type-S. The KW gives you Moton/JRZ performance for Type-S money.

Based on my research the Zanardi sway bar changes are only to the rear bar correct? Part #52300-SL0-J01 & 52316-SL0-J01 (bushings) are still available from Acura. The front bar part #51300-SL0-003 is the same as any other '97-'01 NSX. I confirmed this with Tim @ oemacuraparts.

http://www.nsxprime.com/FAQ/Performance/swaystrutbars.htm

 

[Honcho]

Correct.

 

[jmarksnsx]

Update:

Heard back from both vendors (Prime sponsors) the Type S suspension is now only available if you build it by individual part # which tends to drove up cost. The parts are extremely limited. FWIW you can buy the KWV3 suspension for the same price & it comes with a lifetime warranty.

 

[naaman]

This is what I've been worried about as I plan for the future purchase of my NSX. Stuff that I want becoming harder to get.... oh well... might have to get some KWs, if those are even still available when I finally pull the trigger on a car.

 

[jmarksnsx]

This is what I've been worried about as I plan for the future purchase of my NSX. Stuff that I want becoming harder to get.... oh well... might have to get some KWs, if those are even still available when I finally pull the trigger on a car.

We have very limited number of cars in the grand scheme of things I guess it is good companies like KW support our cars. I wish Honda would continue to support its iconic car as well.