Smell of fuel

[furinax]

Hey all, I've been getting a strong fuel smell while driving. When the windows are open, I can smell it. It is more prominent than before I got my car serviced.

At the body shop, I had a video clip of them driving my car and somehow the fuel line got disconnected and spilled fuel all over the floor. I am not sure why they were messing with that since they just took my rear bumper off. Anyway, I am not sure I trust that they put it back on the right way. Is there any way I can check this?

Injectors are RC550cc and the car is boosted on AEM. I don't see any puddles on the floor while parked. I also checked under the car while it was running and didn't see any fuel. Car runs rich normally. I would hate for it to go up in flames!

 

[Jinks]

Hey all, I've been getting a strong fuel smell while driving. When the windows are open, I can smell it. It is more prominent than before I got my car serviced.

At the body shop, I had a video clip of them driving my car and somehow the fuel line got disconnected and spilled fuel all over the floor. I am not sure why they were messing with that since they just took my rear bumper off. Anyway, I am not sure I trust that they put it back on the right way. Is there any way I can check this?

Injectors are RC550cc and the car is boosted on AEM. I don't see any puddles on the floor while parked. I also checked under the car while it was running and didn't see any fuel. Car runs rich normally. I would hate for it to go up in flames!

Do you have a fuel gauge hooked up? I had a couple fuel gauges and or sensor leak at high psi before.

 

[Old Guy]

Fuel smell inside the car when it is moving, or coming from outside the car when it is running and you have come to a stop? The first would be really strange, the second more understandable.

The 'somehow the fuel line got disconnected while doing a bumper repair' is truly a new one. I struggle with a supply line being disconnected and the car still being able to run; but, perhaps a return line got disconnected or the supply line was not properly re connected. A small fuel leak can be difficult to detect, particularly when it is hot because the gas evaporates quickly; but, a small fuel leak can make a big smell. There is automotive gasoline leak detection equipment available; however, the ones I have seen are a bit pricey for home use and not super common. If you have a fuel pressure tester, you can attach it, pressurize the system and see how fast pressure drops. If it holds pressure then the supply lines are probably good. Unfortunately that does not tell you anything about the return line.

Perhaps the Evap lines got messed up. If the Evap lines got messed up, the car could be releasing gas fumes into the air continuously. If you had an OEM ECU and this was an OBD II car this would throw a MIL pretty dam quick. However, you don't have an OEM ECU. Do you know how your evap lines are connected up? Do you still have the evap solenoids controlled by the AEM or have you switched to venting to free air? If you are venting to free air, that complicates detecting the source of your gas fumes.

 

[furinax]

I figured it out.... fuel spilling out of a line over my engine lol.... really obvious .

 

[furinax]

I'll get a video when it's light out again, but I would like to fix this as quickly as possible. Here is a picture of the engine bay... the leak was spewing gas up into my engine bay cover the moment I turned my car on. It looked like the stainless steel hose burst right around where the ziptie was. I was in a rush to go somewhere so I didn't get a chance to pinpoint it. The fuel was gushing out from the hose right where there is a rubber bulb near the alternator. I would think that I could just take the hose off and go to a parts store to get it replaced? Should I try NAPA?

 

[jwmelvin]

Wow. Replace all the fuel lines in the engine bay. It’s apparently time! I like the push-loc stuff without stainless overwrap; you can order from Summit Racing. The fittings seem expensive but it seems like a reasonable area to spend a few hundred dollars (to me).
[MENTION=12356]Mac Attack[/MENTION] was selling some parts like this a while back; not sure if they were exactly what you need.

 

[furinax]

I tried to start it this morning but didn't get any fuel leakage. Crazy... just yesterday it was spewing out onto my engine bay and I should have lifted the cover to see exactly where it was coming from. I took the fuel hose off and ran water through it... but even with bending it around it didn't show any leaks. I am wondering if it's something else or the pressure just isn't high enough.

Apparently Autozone and NAPA don't have these. I may contact [MENTION=12356]Mac Attack[/MENTION] to see if he can get them to me quickly if I determine this is the issue.

 

[furinax]

Update. I replaced the fuel line from a standard rubber hose from Autozone and things seem to have normalized now. I drove it around to get gas and didn't notice any gas smell. Also, no power loss which I did notice slightly. For now it'll work but since I am supercharged I may look to replace it with a high pressure hose. I took the old hose which was stainless steel braided and cut it open to a point where I thought it was leaking. Turns out I didn't find any leaks. There is white residue in certain parts of the engine bay I figured that was from the fuel spewing.

I am still going to have the fuel injector o-rings replaced (already ordered them) but I never checked them out. After doing some research online an intermittent gas leak can come and go weeks at a time, and only gets worse as the problem persists. I didn't bother looking at these- I guess you can just see if there are puddles around them or wiggle them around? Either way, I am now too afraid to drive the car long distances and am constantly looking into the rear to see if it is spewing fuel. =(

 

[Old Guy]

Are those red fittings on the end of the braided steel fuel line true AN (or push-on) fittings or are they fake AN / Push-on fitting with a conventional hose clamp and barb hidden under the red collar? If they are true AN / Push-on fittings you cannot use over the counter standard rubber hose with those fittings. You need the correct AN / Push-on style hose for use with the fitting or you are going to have another leak. If they are a fake fitting with a barb and screw type hose clamp then the correct size standard rubber fuel hose will work.

From personal experience on other cars, the over the counter standard rubber fuel line sold by the auto supply retailers is unsatisfactory. When used with screw style clamps on barbed fittings the rubber deforms under the clamp which eventually leads to leakage at the fitting. Spring loaded style constant pressure clamps can help but can be a bit bulky. If you are using barbed fittings, I would recommend Gates Barrier or Parker Push-on Abrasion King rubber hoses. They probably cost 2-3 times as much as the over the counter stuff; but, it is not like you are buying huge quantities. I believe that the Parker is acceptable for use with their line of push-on fittings.

If you want reliability, I would be inclined to visit your Acura dealer and order the original fuel line from the fuel filter to the fuel rail. Its a combination of steel and flexible rubber with compression fittings. Lacks the dress-up factor associated with braided stainless steel and colored anodized fittings; but, probably more than up to the task of managing the increased fuel pressure at full boost associated with a supercharger.

 

[furinax]

Are those red fittings on the end of the braided steel fuel line true AN (or push-on) fittings or are they fake AN / Push-on fitting with a conventional hose clamp and barb hidden under the red collar? If they are true AN / Push-on fittings you cannot use over the counter standard rubber hose with those fittings. You need the correct AN / Push-on style hose for use with the fitting or you are going to have another leak. If they are a fake fitting with a barb and screw type hose clamp then the correct size standard rubber fuel hose will work.

From personal experience on other cars, the over the counter standard rubber fuel line sold by the auto supply retailers is unsatisfactory. When used with screw style clamps on barbed fittings the rubber deforms under the clamp which eventually leads to leakage at the fitting. Spring loaded style constant pressure clamps can help but can be a bit bulky. If you are using barbed fittings, I would recommend Gates Barrier or Parker Push-on Abrasion King rubber hoses. They probably cost 2-3 times as much as the over the counter stuff; but, it is not like you are buying huge quantities. I believe that the Parker is acceptable for use with their line of push-on fittings.

If you want reliability, I would be inclined to visit your Acura dealer and order the original fuel line from the fuel filter to the fuel rail. Its a combination of steel and flexible rubber with compression fittings. Lacks the dress-up factor associated with braided stainless steel and colored anodized fittings; but, probably more than up to the task of managing the increased fuel pressure at full boost associated with a supercharger.

They are not spring loaded but there was a barb which the rubber hose was able to attach to. I sealed the edges with this: https://www.permatex.com/products/g...uel-resistant-gasket-dressing-flange-sealant/ and it seems to be holding well. When I took the old hose off, there was electrical tape between the fitting and the hose which leads me to believe maybe that is where the leak came from. Right now my fear is the high pressure will cause the rubber hose to just pop off. Although my research seems to suggest it could have been the injector o-rings, I figure those are usually "drips" and not a spewing anomoly like I saw. Plus, the injectors have a cover and fuel rail over them which makes it more unlikely. I didn't see any fuel buildup around the injectors.

When I get my injector o-rings and some more spare fuel cables (real ones, not rubber ones) I'll have my mechanic re-check the fuel. Ever since this incident my wife has been too scared to sit in the car!

 

[Old Guy]

You probably need to figure out exactly what type of end fittings you have; barbed, socketless, push on. I used the term AN too generally as that refers to the thread system as opposed to the hose connection. Barbed may be sticking in place; but, they definitely need an external clamp to hold them. Socket less and push-on have no external clamp but require a definite style of hose for secure clamping in the fitting. You can make an appropriately sized push on or socketless hose work on a barbed fitting. You cannot get a reliable connection with generic hose on a socketless or push on fitting. Electrical tape has no business anywhere near a fuel hose. It presence is a big red flag that somebody cobbled this together. Like jwmelvin said, time to review all you fuel connections.

My comment about using an original NSX fuel supply line was not valid. It won't fit with your supercharger drive.

With respect to fuel lines, you mentioned real ones not rubber ones. There is nothing wrong with quality rubber hose. It has no problem handling the pressure that the fuel pump can handle. Unless you have an abrasion issue, braided stainless is more about appearance. Getting a good clean cut on braided stainless is a pain and a bad cut can make for a bad seal. On a lot of racecars you will now see fabric braided hoses because of the weight savings.

 

[Mac Attack]

Using vinyl electrical tape to help seal a fuel hose connection is a huge red flag for the integrity of the rest of your non-OEM fuel connections. No wonder it eventually leaked. Wow!

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Edit - I see the picture now where the connection was you were referring to. Someone was probably just lazy and didn't remove the tape they used to make the fuel hose cut before inserting it into the socket to make the connection. That's not the right way, but shouldn't have caused a leak if the hose and fittings were designed to be used together. Also, it looks like it's secured OK so as to not flex too much at the fitting. My guess is someone just did a crummy job at that connection or used cheap hose that broke down over time.
*

Synthetic hoses from Aeroquip and others will work OK. BUT, if you want quality stuff that will last forever and is what all OE manufacturers use now, step up to teflon-lined hose. It's not just the 50 psi pressure your boosted engine fuel hose has to withstand. Cheaper aftermarket stuff will be semi-permeable and fuel vapor will get through. Also, it will degrade over time like the OEM rubber hose. I have to use rubber hose on an old muscle car for the sake of authenticity but don't like it. It's only at a few psi (carb), but the high heat in the engine compartment and today's fuel concoctions lead me to change it every few years just to be safe.

On the NSX I use Goodridge teflon-cored, kevlar braided stuff with DIY re-useable fittings. I did mine about 4-5 years ago and am happy with it. I'm sure there are other competitors out there now. The stuff is awesome though - lightweight, non-abrasive with the kevlar braid, can make ~a 1" bend radius, and is virtually indestructible with a 500psi + burst strength on my 6AN stuff. The teflon shouldn't degrade or allow any fuel vapors to escape. It runs from the fuel pump sender back to the tank. No more rubber.

Here's when I was making fittings and pressure testing them for leakage at about 150 psi (whatever the limit was on my compressor).

Yes, I do have leftover hose and fittings in the classifieds section if you are interested. It's 6AN stuff which looks to be the size you're using. I would redo the hose from your rear bank to the fuel pressure regulator too and reduce the stresses on your fittings.

View attachment 154109

 

[Mac Attack]

At the body shop, I had a video clip of them driving my car and somehow the fuel line got disconnected and spilled fuel all over the floor. I am not sure why they were messing with that since they just took my rear bumper off. Anyway, I am not sure I trust that they put it back on the right way. Is there any way I can check this?

Is this the shop that used tape in the fuel line connection? Why did they say they were messing with the fuel line? Unless they have a really good excuse, I would stay away from that place in the future. Jeez.

 

[texmorales]

Was admiring your setup and would recommend putting your alternator belt shield back on and fabricating a shield for the BBSC shafts drive pulley as well. You have fuel and electrical lines which while unlikely could get damaged by the belt breaking.

Here what I did with mine. Never got around to doing SS fuel line to dress it up like you.

 

[furinax]

Thanks, this is a very good suggestion with shielding the belts. I actually do have a fuel pressure gauge but since I replaced the hose I haven't had any fuel problems. Still taking it easy until then....
[MENTION=12356]Mac Attack[/MENTION]; I already have replacement hoses sent from a friend. I considered ordering those but right now I am not entirely sure of the real issue so I have to be careful with my spending. I wish I could travel back in time and open the engine bay to see where exactly it was spewing from.