BBK Debate, how do you pick one brand over another?

[EuroBoutique]

I'm shopping for a BBK and rims/tires for my NSX. The question I have is that since both are directly related to each other, how do you guys go about getting the right fitment in terms of offset on the wheels and also making sure it does not hit the fender.

The car is dropped on Tien Flex so it will be a lowered stance to start but I want a nice 19" / 18" wheel combo and looking at the Work Varianza's T1s and Work Meister S1r's right now.

Brake wise I'm either considering going with the full Brembo F/R kit + e-brake or going with the Endless mini 6pot brakes up front and just doing cross drilled rotors out back.

Each setup has it's advantage / disadvantage....

Owners who have BBK's can you give me some input on your wheel offsets and other perhaps one picture of each?

Ideally this is what I need to know with each owner / picture:

1) Rim sizing / offset, any rubbing issues WITHOUT rolling fenders

2) Big Brake kit brand and why you picked it?

3) Spacers needed?

4) Price of your setup



big thanks
rick

 

[02#154]

Rick, you'll also want to know the rim manufacturer/model and "face type" if applicable because these things will change the offset required for BBK fitment.

edit: oh, and which "pad" type.

J

 

[BluryNSX]

I just made my descision last week and went with the AP racing/KVR performance kit due to the great reviews and spending a little time on the phone with terry from KVR performance he is extremely knowledgable and answered all my questions and gave me the differences between his kit and stoptech, brambo etc.. Based on his info and the info I found on prime it really looks like more of a balanced kit tested for street and track duty. Although I havent tracked it yet it is going to be soon.

As far as fitment is concerned go on most bbk websites and you can figure out what kind of offset you will need. Pictures just do a search and you can find a few for almost every kit.

 

[EuroBoutique]

Most likey my rim of choice will be the Work Varianza T1s models in 19/18" sizing. I talked to the guys at SOS and they are not sure of the pad type and offset because of the Endless brakes.

I'm pretty much set on Endless 6-pot up front so I need to make sure the brakes will clear the wheels, etc

I'm hoping to avoid the use of spacers if possible and did a search without much avail on Endless brakes since not many people run them.

blurynsx: I really want to check out your ride, sounds like quite a car you are putting together with those brakes!


rick

 

[BluryNSX]

you just tell me when you wanna hook up and we can go grab lunch. I work saturdays but sundays are ussually open...what color endless?

 

[L8apex32]

Most likey my rim of choice will be the Work Varianza T1s models in 19/18" sizing. I talked to the guys at SOS and they are not sure of the pad type and offset because of the Endless brakes.

I'm pretty much set on Endless 6-pot up front so I need to make sure the brakes will clear the wheels, etc

I'm hoping to avoid the use of spacers if possible and did a search without much avail on Endless brakes since not many people run them.

blurynsx: I really want to check out your ride, sounds like quite a car you are putting together with those brakes!


rick

If you put 6-pot calipers up front and use the OEM calipers in back, it is very likely that you'll be creating a very front-biased brake set up. This will decrease maximum brake performance.

Are you increasing rotor sizes also?

If you are leaving the rotors sizes alone and the mini-6-pots up front have the same piston area as the OEM rotors, you aren't improving brake performance to any appreciable degree.

I have not heard of Endless brakes... but that may not be saying much. I lead a sheltered life I guess.

 

[EuroBoutique]

you just tell me when you wanna hook up and we can go grab lunch. I work saturdays but sundays are ussually open...what color endless?

Can you PM me your cell and I'll give you a call I'm free on most weeknights or weekends so pretty flexible.

I want to go with Orange color Endless brakes.


l8apex32: I was going to get the complete Endless front kit including the larger rotors/calipers, etc. A lot of the e46 m3 guys also do the front brake upgrade only and then just the caliper upgrade on the rear. I won't be racing this car so more just for some Bling

Endless is well respected in Japan but quite costly (moreso than Brembo!)


thanks
rick

 

[EuroBoutique]

Guys I know this is my own thread but a friend gave me this link to Endless and has GREAT INFO:

http://og-made.com/archives/category/endless-innovations/


thought I'd pass it along

rick

 

[PhiAlpha44]

I just had the Brembo GT BBK front and rear installed. HRE wheels. 18 front, 19 rear. Pretty much the exact setup you're looking for. I went with the Brembo GT's because it's a plug and play system and I personally like Brembo Brakes. IMO it's the best brake system you can get without going insane with the 10k dollar Indy system.

 

[EuroBoutique]

I just had the Brembo GT BBK front and rear installed. HRE wheels. 18 front, 19 rear. Pretty much the exact setup you're looking for. I went with the Brembo GT's because it's a plug and play system and I personally like Brembo Brakes. IMO it's the best brake system you can get without going insane with the 10k dollar Indy system.

Did you get the E-brake option? What color calipers?

Any pics to share with us?


thanks
rick

 

[PhiAlpha44]

I did do the E brake! Black Calipers with the Brembo Logo in white. But soon I'll be making that logo orange to match the car. :wink:

<a href="http://s120.photobucket.com/albums/o164/PhiAlpha44/?action=view&current=l_9ae7732d670fc835b476e9444809e5f1.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o164/PhiAlpha44/l_9ae7732d670fc835b476e9444809e5f1.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

<a href="http://s120.photobucket.com/albums/o164/PhiAlpha44/?action=view&current=BremboHRE.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o164/PhiAlpha44/BremboHRE.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

 

[Big_D]

Those look sweet PhiAlpha...your car is looking choice!

 

[nsx1164]

I just made my descision last week and went with the AP racing/KVR performance kit due to the great reviews and spending a little time on the phone with terry from KVR performance he is extremely knowledgable and answered all my questions and gave me the differences between his kit and stoptech, brambo etc..

Can you post info and contacts for the AP/KVR dealer ? Thanks in advance.

 

[sugoi]

I had a very bad experience with KVR BBK for my 92 Civic a while back because they kept sent me either wrong parts or parts that never worked properly. I went thru 2 of their kits and none of them worked. My civic was on stand more than 3 months before I demanded money back or I would post the bad experience on internet. In the end, KVR credited me back and decided never order their products again. Anyway this is just my opinion on KVR.

 

[Hugh]

Ideally this is what I need to know with each owner / picture:

1) Rim sizing / offset, any rubbing issues WITHOUT rolling fenders

2) Big Brake kit brand and why you picked it?

3) Spacers needed?

4) Price of your setup
big thanks
rick

1) HRE 545 at 17x8 ET38 Front - 18x10 ET39 Rear
I also have a set of 5Zigen FN01R-C wheels in 17x8 and 18x9.5 both ET35. The rears fit without a spacer but the fronts need a 3mm spacer to fit. For now that is. They're going to a machine shop to have 3mm shaved from the inside of the spokes.

2) Stop Tech because they are the best.. (No Italian crap for Charlotte)
Download NSX specific fitment templates here.

3) None

4) Wheels - $First born male child
BBK - $4000 w/E-Brake installed. (These were already at the shop and ordered for 2 lamers that reneged on their purchases. One set was black and the other was yellow. The price I paid included having them powder coated red.)

 

[Hugh]

I did do the E brake! Black Calipers with the Brembo Logo in white. But soon I'll be making that logo orange to match the car. :wink:

How do you plan on doing the logo? I just got new Stop Techs that had to be powder coated red. So I'm having Stop Tech spelled out in high temp vinyl decals using the Iron Maiden font. You want a set? :biggrin:

 

[Hugh]

Can you post info and contacts for the AP/KVR dealer ? Thanks in advance.

I believe SoS can help you with that.

 

[Jetpilot3]

Most likey my rim of choice will be the Work Varianza T1s models in 19/18" sizing. rick

Nice choice! I'll be going the BBK route and installing StopTech most likely...

 

[Meeyatch1]

At the end of the day, how much improvement are we talking about over stock brakes with a good pad? I have been reading this thread, and others, trying to figure that out. It seems like there is really not that much improvement to justify the several thousand dollars spent.

 

[docjohn]

At the end of the day, how much improvement are we talking about over stock brakes with a good pad? I have been reading this thread, and others, trying to figure that out. It seems like there is really not that much improvement to justify the several thousand dollars spent.

Personaly Mitch if my car is never gonna see the track regularly and the oem brakes are well maintained and have good pads I don't see any performance benefit to justify the cost.So then it becomes an esthetic/bling/perception decision,which to many is more important.

 

[Hugh]

At the end of the day, how much improvement are we talking about over stock brakes with a good pad? I have been reading this thread, and others, trying to figure that out. It seems like there is really not that much improvement to justify the several thousand dollars spent.

Well, let's look at why we upgraded the front brakes in the first place. Contrary to popular belief, the real reason sports- and racing cars use big brakes is to deal with heat. Period. There has been a bunch of stuff published which will disclaim this, but when you look at the braking system from a design standpoint, making them 'bigger' doesn't fundamentally do anything for stopping distance. It's all about the heat.

For more valuable brake system information, simply read the Stop Tech White Papers

Personaly Mitch if my car is never gonna see the track regularly and the oem brakes are well maintained and have good pads I don't see any performance benefit to justify the cost.So then it becomes an esthetic/bling/perception decision,which to many is more important.

Exactly. I did it because an opportunity presented itself to get a set way cheaper than usual and because I was starting to get tired of the way the stock calipers looked behind the nice wheels.

The OEM brakes are VERY VERY good. Just ask keN SaX who has been tracking his cars for years with them. All they need for a street upgrade are stainless lines and CarboTech Bobcats.

 

[SOURCE 1]

Ok, Ok yeah the stock brakes on these cars are great!!!!


BUT! My shop just got done with Phialpha's car a couple weeks ago.. I drove his car, then drove my 95 with stock brakes then drove my 91 with stock brakes. I can tell you his set up is SUPERB! It is a much more balanced and tight feeling braking system. The way they brake feels much better than stock. Having driven three nsx's within 10 minutes of one another I can tell you ( in my opinion) that the Brembos are much better than stock brakes.

Now on the other hand I am not perfectly sure if the cost is worth the difference but I do feel a big difference.

Just my .02

Maybe I need to upgrade to the carbotech bobcats that sax runs.

 

[docjohn]

Ok, Ok yeah the stock brakes on these cars are great!!!!


BUT! My shop just got done with Phialpha's car a couple weeks ago.. I drove his car, then drove my 95 with stock brakes then drove my 91 with stock brakes. I can tell you his set up is SUPERB! It is a much more balanced and tight feeling braking system. The way they brake feels much better than stock. Having driven three nsx's within 10 minutes of one another I can tell you ( in my opinion) that the Brembos are much better than stock brakes.

Now on the other hand I am not perfectly sure if the cost is worth the difference but I do feel a big difference.

Just my .02

Maybe I need to upgrade to the carbotech bobcats that sax runs.

How old is your fluid/pads?

 

[nsxhk]

Ok, Ok yeah the stock brakes on these cars are great!!!!


BUT! My shop just got done with Phialpha's car a couple weeks ago.. I drove his car, then drove my 95 with stock brakes then drove my 91 with stock brakes. I can tell you his set up is SUPERB! It is a much more balanced and tight feeling braking system. The way they brake feels much better than stock. Having driven three nsx's within 10 minutes of one another I can tell you ( in my opinion) that the Brembos are much better than stock brakes.

Now on the other hand I am not perfectly sure if the cost is worth the difference but I do feel a big difference.

Just my .02

Maybe I need to upgrade to the carbotech bobcats that sax runs.

Imo, the oem brakes are MORE than adequate for any street or spirited use. I think you're just getting the mods bug!