OMG - Dealer Wrecked My '04

[Tep]

Glad to see that things are heading in the right direction. You can always help prep my car for the oc car show while you're NSX-less :biggrin:


and I got a default :corner: on this one :smile:

 

[john@johnhudakracing]

Okay, here's the update.

As mentioned, aside from being x-less at the boardwalk for the summer, it sounds as if you have received a satisfactory resolution to the situation. All that's left between you and being made whole is 4-5 months of downtime.

Obviously the safe bet is to seal it up in ink asap (do the paperwork today if possible) get that thing fixed and then do your part and wait it out as opposed to taking any risks of further complicating the situation with any incidentals. Afterall- anything can and does happen and it's obviously a sensitive situation and there's nothing wrong with playing it safe.

I suppose that the opposing viewpoint would be that if your willing to assume more personal risk, and... as it's being traded anyway, the sky is the limit- hell mine as well order some brake pads and fluid today. Here we go, I have an extra set of harnesses sitting here. :tongue:

 

[FTRNSXR]

If you are happy with the price they are giving for the car, it seems like a fair deal. Not great considering your troubles, but fair. I hope that they have not tried to give you trade-in on the car.

I would have the agreed upon price for the replacement car in writing. In addition, what about getting cash in hand for the service time associated with the install of the parts so that you could use whichever service department/mechanic you choose.

 

[queenlives]

naturally, you'll get all of this in legalese/writing...

aside from that, it doesn't seem unreasonable that you receive:

* your legal bills related to this paid them
* preferred-customer discounts on any/all parts/services you buy from them in the future

all things considered, seems like a reasonably good arrangement - congrats on your approach and results.

be well.

 

[NSXDreamer2]

You probably already know this, but I just wanted to add that after you get their on ink, bring it to your lawyer to read it and see if there's any tricky wording. Attoneys are good at picking those up. Somewhere along the line of "play it safe"...

I would strongly oppose the idea of driving the blue repaired one, asiding chances of you are getting into risk (thought unlikely, but never say never, right?) and hell breaks loose again. They still take a month or two to fix it. To me, driving a comparable rental is the best solution. (no need to get a P-car, even a G35 or Corvette will do.)

 

[NSX-Tuner]

Okay, here's the update.

1) Get it in writing and reviewed by an attorney (like others have suggested).
2) Don't drive the repaired car. It's now theirs, so you don't want to risk messing up the deal.
3) Hope this works out for you...

 

[SCS2k]

Just out of curiosity, is the tech who smashed your car related to this person?: :biggrin:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/04/15/dealership.accident.ap/index.html

 

[95Mr2Turbo]

Ryan,

I'm sure it's gonna be tempting to drive the '04 after it's repaired until the '05 arrives, but I've got a bad feeling about that idea. I think the best course of action may be to just take a sabbatical from NSX's for a few months and wait for the '05 without an NSX to drive. My 2 cents.

 

[Da Hapa]

Okay, here's the update.

First of all, I can't tell you how happy I am to read this. Weird that I don't even know you but after reading all of this over the last few days I've found myself becoming more and more interested in seeing you find an acceptable outcome. This is great news.

Second.. get it in writing.

Third... don't for one second think of driving the repaired car. It's time to remove the uncertainties and not increase any risk to you. Take a few months off... rent a car if you really need to... and wait for your beautiful new car to show up.

 

[RyanITV]

I'm leaning more towards not driving it. I'd be too paranoid that something happens to it while it's under my care. At least I have the Jeep to fall back on so I can drive and get some sun.

They've put everything down in writing (I did it, actually, and got their agreement to it; it summarizes the arrangement and even includes the terms of purchase of the new one). It's not a freebie, nor did I ask for one - it'll cost us a bit to get the '05, but the point is that we're not taking ANY hit at all on the '04 and coming out slightly ahead.

We're still actively trying to find an '05 white/black combo ahead of the arrival of a new one, so if anyone sees or hears of one, please let me know.

I think they were in a panic with this, but in the end, they appear to be doing the right thing by me. It's cool that rather than get all heated and nasty and dragging attorneys into it, we were able to come to an agreement and get it resolved. When the new '05 arrives, they've just secured a customer for years to come.

Ryan

 

[White92]

Let's all cross our fingers and hope something stupid doesn't happen in the end like the trasporter carrying your 05 rolls on the way to the dealership.
If this whole situation were happening to me, that's what would happen. I have the worst luck.

 

[mystican]

What is going on with the tech who crashed it in the first place?

 

[NSX-Tuner]

Just look at it this way... having to wait 3,4 or 5 months before driving an X again will make you so much more appreciative of it. Ever time I wait a couple of weeks between drives in my X, I feel like I'm visiting a long lost friend... Unfortunately, I get a little rusty on my X driving skills.

 

[RyanITV]

What is going on with the tech who crashed it in the first place?

Not sure - I hope he keeps his job, as he's a good guy and he's the only one I trust working on the car. Note that I didn't say anything about driving it. :biggrin:

Ryan

 

[RyanITV]

Just look at it this way... having to wait 3,4 or 5 months before driving an X again will make you so much more appreciative of it. Ever time I wait a couple of weeks between drives in my X, I feel like I'm visiting a long lost friend...

Considering I'll be driving a vehicle with the aerodynamics of a wall and a 0-60 time of an wounded donkey, I'm pretty sure the drive home from the dealer will alternate between pure bliss and culture shock. :biggrin:

Ryan

 

[LJSB]

You aren't fencing with anyone, you just aren't "getting it"...

Oh I think I'm getting it just fine, you like to wiggle when you talk. :biggrin:

The bottom line is- D/V IS real- and claims DO get paid- or did you miss this post? \/

I haven't missed the post but I have not seen it here in real life in NY and can not verify the circumstances,or context of the settlement referenced in this post.

This subject has now strayed VERY off topic from the thread since Ryan apparently doesn't need to concern himself with D/V at this point given the turn of events since my origional post.

You're right, I really didn't need to respond to you at all. It was advice that would not be heeded by anyone with good sense or consul.

pbassjo- if you still have questions about insurance- call your agent, maybe they can bring you comprehension. At the very least they are collecting your premiums to deal with the frustration. :tongue:
Philip

As Insurance pertains to my industry in my state, I am very well versed and familiar with the regulations, language and concepts.
I hold a license with the NYS Dept. of Ins. as a adjuster of auto damage claims which is not a requirement of my job.

The agents in my area aren't frustrated by me at all. They come to me to have their families cars repaired and for advice in auto claims even if I spend my insurance dollars elsewhere. It would seem I can "wrap my mind" around the concepts quite well.

FYI I have been offered management positions by more than one major carrier which would suggest that I must "get it" when it come to insurance and claims settlements.

Hope to meet you at NSXPO in Phoenix, if I do I'll buy the first round. :wink:
I hope Ryan has his NEW car and brings it along as well, though it is a haul for folks us up here in the North. Maybe some pics?

 

[Tony Montoya]

Looking good. I can do four months without an NSX standing on my head.

 

[steveny]

Looking good. I can do four months without an NSX standing on my head.

You must have a strong neck! :biggrin:

 

[MJK]

New '04 Re-Pet

 

[ocwrx2]

couple things: first of all im sorry for your loss, if i were you i'd get another blue one. that blue is IMHO the best color option especially with the black leather. although i do feel bad for the tech driving it, i think the accident should be investigated and if he was driving reckless he should no longer be employed by acura. but thats just my opinion. if it was just an accident then nothing should happen to him. as far as what the dealer is doing, i think what would be fair is for you to pay off the blue one(i think you said something like 70k owed on it?)and get a brand new 05 at no cost to you. the dealer realizes that you could easily sue them and get more than just 90k(for a new 05) and they should be bending over backwards to make things right for you not just offering you your blue 04 as a trade in as if it was in perfect condition. you've still had to suffer the aggravation of having to deal with the dealer on this when they should have immediately said "sir, one of our techs crashed your car, he works for us so its our responsibility, if you would pay off the remaining balance on the 04 we will have a new 05 shipped to your door promptly.) but again thats just my opinion.

 

[Osiris_x11]

well, uhh, ahh, umm, sighhhhhhhhhhhhhh!?!

hmmm... In simplest terms, is this the outcome:

Proposed settlement agreed to by both parties:

- The dealer will buy Ryan's 2004 Blue 6spd NSX-T that was damaged by one of their techs during a service visit. The buy-back will be in the ballpark of a trade-in value, allowing complete pay-off from Ryan.

- Ryan has no NSX nor does he owe the bank anything.

- Dealer will find/order Ryan a brand-new 2005 NSX-T 6spd of his choice (ie. White/Black).

- Dealer will swap the aftermarket parts/accessories from Ryan's damaged Blue 2004 NSX-T to his newly acquired White 2005 NSX-T, for no cost.

- Ryan is content & will patronize the dealer in the future w/o hesitation.

- Dealer fixes Ryan's Blue 2004 NSX-T and puts it up for sale (unsure if 'clean' title or whether it can be certified by Acura).

- The End.


My queries:

Ryan, will you be getting the brand-new White 2005 NSX-T at dealer's cost (MSRP - Holdover % = Ryan's Cost)...?

* will you be getting zero % financing from the dealership?

* will the dealer do all your scheduled maintenence as per Acura's specifications for free during the entire time you own your Acura?

* will the dealer include some sort of grievance compensation for your lost time, aggravation, stress, and downtime from driving a 2004 NSX-T?

* will the dealer offer "behind doors" incentives towards future purchases ONLY for you?


IMHO, I feel all-of-the-above is the most impartial deal that anyone outside of the two parties would see it as.

Without a doubt, I am sure Lexus would offer some sort of compensation package out that would be beyond words and comprehension. Why? Their number one priority is their reputation & customer satisfaction. They would take a loss, any loss to keep both perfect.

 

[RyanITV]

Re: well, uhh, ahh, umm, sighhhhhhhhhhhhhh!?!

My queries:

Ryan, will you be getting the brand-new White 2005 NSX-T at dealer's cost (MSRP - Holdover % = Ryan's Cost)...?

* will you be getting zero % financing from the dealership?

* will the dealer do all your scheduled maintenence as per Acura's specifications for free during the entire time you own your Acura?

* will the dealer include some sort of grievance compensation for your lost time, aggravation, stress, and downtime from driving a 2004 NSX-T?

* will the dealer offer "behind doors" incentives towards future purchases ONLY for you?


IMHO, I feel all-of-the-above is the most impartial deal that anyone outside of the two parties would see it as.

Without a doubt, I am sure Lexus would offer some sort of compensation package out that would be beyond words and comprehension. Why? Their number one priority is their reputation & customer satisfaction. They would take a loss, any loss to keep both perfect.

Out of respect for them, I'm not goign to disclose the price of the new one. It's not quite cost, but it works fine for me and was a number we agreed on.

Special financing has been arranged.

No free maintenance - again, I didn't want special treatment, I just wanted a whole, never-wrecked car.

No additional compensation. I've got a loaner for the time being, but that goes back once the 2004 is fixed. Again, works fine for me.

They've always taken care of us - we've gotten fantastic deals on the past couple of cars and (on my last trade), they even came back and gave us a check for $2k AFTER the car was sold because they sold it for more than they thought they'd get.

End result - we're happy, and I've got a perfect car to use for my fake NSX-R project. Like I'd said - the white was our first choice; we "settled" for the blue last time.

Ryan

 

[Osiris_x11]

contentment, at last!

hmmm... The only thing that matters now is that you're satisfied!

Sincerely looking fwd to seeing your NSX-R project. Can I have your shift-knob?!? j/k :tongue:

It's amazing how life works at times, as you originally wanted a white 'face-lifted' NSX-T!

 

[H-carWizKid]

I haven't missed the post but I have not seen it here in real life in NY and can not verify the circumstances,or context of the settlement referenced in this post.

So... You won't take it from someone who has the experience, how do you REALLY expect ME to do that for you?

I don't think you do. I think you are being vindictive.

You're right, I really didn't need to respond to you at all. It was advice that would not be heeded by anyone with good sense or consul.

ABSOLUTELY! I mean- why bother to look into getting your equity position back after somebody partially destroyed your property?!?!

I guess you'd have to be an idiot...

Hope to meet you at NSXPO in Phoenix, if I do I'll buy the first round. :wink:

I will be there, but really...At this point you are just being vindictive, and I don't associate with that sort.

In order to (I have no idea why I am bothering) bring closure to this subject, as far off topic as it now is...I did what people do when we want information. I ran a search....

Live from the internet- a simple search- including an FAQ- In the future- ask Jeeves Mr. pbassjo- perhaps HE can bring you stillness of mind.

What is
diminished value?


Inherent diminished value is the decrease in fair market value a vehicle suffers as the result of a collision, irrespective of the quality of repair. Not every vehicle suffers diminished value, and not every type of damage creates diminished value. However diminished value almost always occurs with more than slight damage -- particularly when a late model, classic, or specialty vehicle is involved in the collision.


When a vehicle has been damaged, merely returning the vehicle to its prior appearance and function does not return the vehicle to its pre-loss condition. Issues regarding the vehicle's warranty arise which may include having the warranty restricted or even voided. State and Federal laws may require disclosure of damage and repair. Sales tax value may be lost. Vehicle histories are easy to track, and an adverse history can cost thousands of dollars to a vehicle owner. So merely properly repairing the vehicle can never return it to what it once was. Damage to a vehicle's pedigree is like stamping "Damaged Goods" across a vehicle's title.




Who is affected by
diminished value?

Consumers
Financial institutions
Leasing companies
Insurers
Collision industry
Vehicle owners, whether they are individuals, private organizations, banks, or leasing companies, suffer loss when their property is stripped of quantifiable value. Insurers suffer when they pay inflated diminished value claims or squander resources while struggling to quantify diminished value. The collision industry is often unfairly blamed for vehicles' post-collision drop in value, when the damage - not the repair - is the source of the decrease.




FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS
NOTE: Some of the information contained in these answers relate to general principles of insurance and damage recovery. It should not be construed as legal advice nor relied upon as such, and you should ALWAYS consult with an attorney licensed to practice in your state and knowledgeable as to the issues presented. For more information, please read the Terms and Conditions for using this website.

/\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\

Gee- they seem to think it is a good idea to consult an attorney for your state for this matter... wonder why?

But- hey Fellas, you can skip that step! just ask pbassjo- he is probably an attorney too...

(oops... now who is being vindictive? Kinda fun though...

DIMINISHED VALUE- Frequently asked questions...

I was just involved in an accident. Has my car been diminished in value?

Very likely; however, inherent diminished value is not guaranteed to occur every time a vehicle has suffered collision damage. Whether a vehicle suffers diminished value depends on many factors, including the type and severity of damage, make, model, year, mileage, options, and prior history.

Does my ability to recover inherent diminished value depend on whether I was at- fault for the accident?

Usually, it does. There are two entirely different grounds for recovering the loss in value which apply depending on your status as either a first party or a third party. First parties are usually asking their own insurers to pay for the decrease in value and whether the insurer pays for that decrease is driven by the terms of the insurance policy. Third parties usually ask the at-fault driver's insurer to pay for the decrease in value as part of the property damage caused by the company's insured. (Several of the posted articles explain the diminished value issues in greater detail.)

What are first parties and third parties?

A first party is a person (or entity) seeking to recover diminished value from his/her own insurance policy. First parties are typically, but not always, the drivers responsible for the accident. Third parties are typically the drivers who have been hit.

I live in a "no fault" state. Does that make a difference?

Yes. Your ability to collect the inherent diminished value depends on the terms of your insurance policy and the public policies of the state.

Are first parties entitled to recover inherent diminished value?

In the State of Georgia, absolutely. In a decision rendered in November of 2001, the Georgia Supreme Court announced that insurance companies are responsible for returning an insured's vehicle to its "pre-loss" condition in terms of both operation and value.

Several other states presented with the question of whether the at-fault driver can demand inherent diminished value payment from his/her own insurer have said, "No."

Is there a formula to determine inherent diminished value?

Not with accuracy. Many insurers use the "17c" formula which came out of the settlement reached after the 2001 decision from Georgia. However, there is no substantiation for the elements of the formula, why it is valid, and it is fundamentally flawed because it improperly deducts for mileage twice.

Are third parties entitled to recover inherent diminished value payments?

Yes. A third party's basis for recovery of inherent diminished value is entirely different than a first party's claim through his/her own insurer. Actually, the at-fault driver's insurance company cuts through a few steps when it pays to repair your car. Instead of forcing you to sue its insured for the damage and loss in value caused to your car, the at-fault driver's insurance company accepts responsibility and authorizes payment. The cost to repair your car, however, is only one element of the vehicle's change in fair market value, and you are entitled to demand compensation for the total decrease in value.

Mr. pbassjo-
Since you have passed a test in your state to hold an adjusters license, and are now a highly acclaimed insurance professional in your region- I wouldn't want to challenge your vast and great knowledge of all things claims involved. Certainly when it came to this subject, you proved you know everything you need to, and I couldn't possibly contribute anything to your great wealth of experience and knowledge. I will go back to doing my job handling claims now. Thanks for the lesson. :wink:

Philip

(BTW: The lesson: Some men you just can't reach... )

 

[ocwrx2]

well ryan is a good guy for letting the dealer get off easy like this. if i was in his shoes i'd be raising hell about it.

osiris - lol i got a good laugh out of seeing you put "ryan will patronize the dealership". i know what you meant but it sounds funny.