The Cartek Turbo kit...... ??

[sjs]

Geez, so much information. Too bad lots of it is wrong.

Too much to sift through and comment on all of it but one begs a response:

Hey, whats up Netviper ....I'm not sure that "390BHP" rating is accurate** I say that becuase they've stolen the literature from the way that kit was previously made by Cartek back in the day *before* the refinements (which appear to be significant). Didn't that kit use a cheap VATN type turbocharger before that flowed worth sh*t and was unreliable? ...

No, it used (or in my case still uses) the most elegant, advanced and quickest spooling turbos ever produced. The adjustable variable vane design allows them to spin up as early as you wish, then open to flow like a larger unit. Yes, they are too small to push high boost, but that’s called “good design” in a system intended to run on stock internals. Nothing dumber than putting a huge turbo on a an engine then never use enough boost to get them into the sweet spot of their compressor map. Can you say lag? . Unreliable? Well, admittedly a lot of people had problems with the relatively fragile turbos, but there were two primary reasons for that. People tried to turn the boost up beyond what they can support, which will kill any turbo, and they were mounted to the outlet side of the catalytic converters which occasionally spit out bits of debris as they age. That’s real hard on little spinning turbine fans. The other problem was the seizing of the vane actuator rod, but after 4+ years and a lot of abuse mine are still just fine.

Ben pretty well summed it up from his own experience, but hopefully the Cartech guys have since done a better job updating the system than their website. That horrible picture was version 0.9 of the Bell kit, probably taken from his book.

As for trying to push more than 400 from that system, I wouldn’t bother. The plumbing is a direct carryover from Bell which means the pipes are small, and the intercoolers appear to be the same as well which means they are not up to the task for more than short bursts above 5psi. Other than that, if they have the oil and coolant systems sorted out (something the Aerondynes don’t need BTW) then there is no reason to believe that the system isn’t worth owning assuming that you can live with its limits. Personally, without the Aerodynes I’d rather keep it simple and run a single turbo, but for the price I think they have a very competitive product. I’m just amazed at how people without any technical or personal knowledge will trash something in a public forum.

 

[KGP]

*sigh* i hate having to undo myself from my slumber to search, but I did, and here's my link

http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34136&highlight=bbsc+dyno
:biggrin: I just have to throw this in there---> I guess gene's brain is slipping, since you actually posted in that thread (where i posted the dyno)

Sorry, peiser! Yes, I did see that sheet. I was thinking (before I posted here) it was just a comparo overlay you had done because of the thread name, but not necessarily from your car. Selective re-reading at its best. My bad! :redface:

 

[nsxsupra]

....I know the turbokit.com site doesn't traditionally have a great reputation but my friend recently saw this new Cartek turbo kit from there for $7,899 ** It uses the more reliable T28's turbos and seems to be all there (being an AEM computer w/ fuel system is being offered with the kit**) ...is this too good to be true ? Does ANYONE out there have any experience with the lastest Cartek offering or is in ka-hoots with the people behind it ??? Very interested, thanks!

The link*** ----> http://www.turbo-kits.com/nsx_turbo_kits.html

I believe Autowave has the newer version of this kit in stock. I have seen the kit in person, looks much much nicer than the old pic on turbokit.com.

Dual SMIC, AEM EMS, Exhaust at around $7500 is great deal.

A good set of exhaust/header combo for NSX is close to $3500, with the turbo kit, it alreday included exhaust and turbo manifold.

 

[jorligan]

My car was the first one to have the system, it was the test mule. The current intercooler is thicker than the one originally in the BEGI system which is what SJS has. He is correct in that the exhaust pipes and turbo pipes are SMALL, 2.5 inch diameter. I heard that Autowave is installing the Cartech kit and that they have also redone the oiling system but have no experience. PM me if you want details about my current system.

Agree with SJS, I would probably go with a simple single turbo system. If the Cartech system is to be used, 1. External Wastegate. 2. Different Oiling System 3. Ball Bearing turbos 4. AEM or HKS ECU.

Tim

 

[MiamieNeSeX]

Agree with SJS, I would probably go with a simple single turbo system. If the Cartech system is to be used, 1. External Wastegate. 2. Different Oiling System 3. Ball Bearing turbos 4. AEM or HKS ECU.

Tim

If these changes are done (or needed), can you still call it a Cartech Kit?

Armando

 

[nsxlover]

The kit is sitting in my garage. Anyone wanna come over and help me install it? I do have a built engine and am going to push the t-28's as high as they can go. Maybe around 14-15psi. With the old kit at 12psi, it dynoes at 450something. I should be able to get around 500+-rwhp.

 

[nbovelle]

Hey Rob,

I would love to help you.
When do you plan to install it?

Nate in DC

 

[nsxlover]

Sometime in the next couple weekends. Should only take a day, as I already have the old one off. Give me a call. 443-271-8595

Rob

 

[KGP]

Watcha waiting for?

Dual SMIC, AEM EMS, Exhaust at around $7500 is great deal.

A good set of exhaust/header combo for NSX is close to $3500, with the turbo kit, it alreday included exhaust and turbo manifold.

You have been asking questions in the forum about exhausts. Presumably because you are interested in purchasing one. So, what's stopping you from the turbos?

 

[nsxsupra]

Re: Watcha waiting for?

You have been asking questions in the forum about exhausts. Presumably because you are interested in purchasing one. So, what's stopping you from the turbos?

Never did said I will never go turbo (GJ, FX, Cartech etc), just been through single turbo conversion in Supra not too long ago, could use a little break.

If you want to pay for the kit for me, I will do the turbo conversion immediately:biggrin: J/K

Been Working my way up slowly last few months for the NSX, weight reduction, odyssey PC545 battery, new tires, upgraded to oem 16/17 solaris silver wheels from oem 15/16" wheels, lowering springs, cantrell AIS. Exhaust will be next.

 

[Jasil]

Hopefully your 11th post will have some basis in real world applications. Use the search function and do some research on turbo charging the NSX, then you wont make useless comments like this.

How many turbo cars have you had? How much do you know about engines, tuning, turbos, and how to make HP?

There is nothing special about a NSX engine 3.0 or 3.2! It's not cutting edge technology there is nothing fancy about it. If Cartek indeed does have a kit that they will sell for 8K it's a steal compared to everything else out on the market. Of course, that is if the kit actually bolts up without much fuss.

My comment about upgrading the compressors was supposed to be taken at face value. Upgraded T-28's support 650rwhp of airflow..PERIOD. Will the engine handle that stock NO! Will you have use a AEM or Motec, YES! Will intercoolers need to be upgraded, Injectors, pumps, possible lines, clutch...all a resounding YES!

I've probably swapped more turbos than you have oil changes. I've owned a Rx-7 (Unreliable money pit), Supercharged 91 mustang, 5 DSM's all with various turbos and upgrades, and currently a 03' Cobra 470rwhp with bolt ons.

A engine is a engine, but if your not mechanically inclined I guess you will just continue to pay the "Extortion" type prices that current vendors charge for forced induction.

 

[waymilky]

Sprinkled throughout this thread, and for that matter throughout the FI forum, are mentions of the FX 400. One person after another paints this as the "gold standard" system for non-built engines. However, having talked with Mikey at Factor X, I don't think any FX 400s are in customer hands. He told me they haven't sold a single FX 400, as all customers who came interested in the FX 400, left with the FX 500. Now this may say something grand about the FX 500, but it also says something about all of you singing the praises of the FX 400.

 

[NetViper]

Now this may say something grand about the FX 500, but it also says something about all of you singing the praises of the FX 400.

I had a ride in the FX400 so I can pretty much tell you it kicks ass. Now, before you go call factor X to see how many people have had rides in a FX400, let me just tell you that it was the FX500 detuned to about 400rwhp because they had just had an "issue" on the hiway when they were pushing A LOT more HP.

The reality is there are very few people that own any turbo kits for the NSX. My guess would be under 20. Both the GJ Turbo and Factor X turbo are very new products to the NSX scene. As you can read, the Cartek kit is an evolution of an older kit, but it sounds like there are still some issues there.

Personally, I am just glad we have people like that that are willing to invest their time in money into a car that has a very small audience. That includes Comptech, Mark Basch, SOS and anyone else that invests their time and money to make our cars better.

 

[KGP]

I've probably swapped more turbos than you have oil changes. I've owned a Rx-7 (Unreliable money pit), Supercharged 91 mustang, 5 DSM's all with various turbos and upgrades, and currently a 03' Cobra 470rwhp with bolt ons.

What year NSX do you own?

 

[jcjcf1]

Sprinkled throughout this thread, and for that matter throughout the FI forum, are mentions of the FX 400. One person after another paints this as the "gold standard" system for non-built engines. However, having talked with Mikey at Factor X, I don't think any FX 400s are in customer hands. He told me they haven't sold a single FX 400, as all customers who came interested in the FX 400, left with the FX 500. Now this may say something grand about the FX 500, but it also says something about all of you singing the praises of the FX 400.

I have no facts to dispute what you're saying about Factor X and the FX400, but it doesn't seem likely to me that all potential customers for the FX400, at say $10k, finally decide to go with the FX500 at $18k plus extras and other upgrades that would be "required" - customization of the installation, BBK, suspension upgrades, etc. Surely there is a market for the FX400 at the lower price point, and it seems to me that there is likely some other reason that no FX400's are in customer hands. Just a guess, however.

 

[MiamieNeSeX]

let me just tell you that it was the FX500 detuned to about 400rwhp because they had just had an "issue" on the hiway when they were pushing A LOT more HP.

.

So explain to us what's the "use" of all that HP if you cant "use" it?


Maybe I should have posted this in the other thread.


Armando

 

[Jasil]

What year NSX do you own?

Searching for a 92-94 black/black 5spd as we speak.

 

[NetViper]

So explain to us what's the "use" of all that HP if you cant "use" it?

Pm'd you.

 

[KGP]

Searching for a 92-94 black/black 5spd as we speak.

Wow. There are quite a few people looking for the same thing right now. Early blacks seem to be the hot ticket right now. So, are you going to boost? Consider buying one already boosted? If so, PM me for an great condition 91 ctsc.

 

[len3.8]

Wow. There are quite a few people looking for the same thing right now. Early blacks seem to be the hot ticket right now. So, are you going to boost? Consider buying one already boosted? If so, PM me for an great condition 91 ctsc.

Or me for a highly boosted 95.("Black", Not cheap though) Everything is for sale in my garage, and the ones that are supposed to be in my garage. :smile:

Oops, I am off topic. The cartech kits seems to be a viable option for 10-15k. There is no way, anyone doing it correctly, is going to stop at 10K. And 18k for the FX500 or GJ kit, Dream the hell on!!!! Jump in the long line, and prepare to wait. Have what you want plan on doing laid out, after you have corresponded with the tuners. I would suggest letting them in on everything you plan on buying.
Be REAL flexible with your timeline, I know of people that have been waiting for a long time.
Len

 

[KGP]

Or me for ahighly boosted 95.(Not cheap though) Everything is for sale in my garage, and the ones that are supposed to be in my garage. :smile:

Oops, I am off topic. The cartech kits seems to be a viable option for 10-15k, there is no way, anyone doing it correctly, is going to stop at 10K. And 18k for the FX500 or GJ kit, Dream the hell on!!!!
Len

I think this post does relate to this thread in an odd sort of way. If the Cartek kit proves to have the bugs worked out (big "if"), and also is a fairly easy bolt-on (another "if"), then yes, it would be a great value. The reason being resides within Len's statement. The high boost kits are very expensive. However, there's something else that most everyone would consider costly about them; It is not all that simple a task going through the process. While a vendor can be very diligent in communication, there's always the fact that you can't simply walk into the shop on a given day and check progress or go through a "hands-on" two-way discussion. I'm quite sure that Len, Sig, TurboNSX, StevenLee, Big Al, Gary (and all the other high hp turbo guys) feels the same way, in that what they did to their car should be worth more than what they spent. I know it's a difficult thing to understand, but that's how it feels. So, if Len is willing to part with his, and provided someone is considering a GJTC, then by all means - jump fast and pay the price. It won't get any easier, or cheaper. I stake my "Great Reputation" on that, 100%. :tongue: :smile:

 

[waymilky]

I have no facts to dispute what you're saying about Factor X and the FX400, but it doesn't seem likely to me that all potential customers for the FX400, at say $10k, finally decide to go with the FX500 at $18k plus extras and other upgrades that would be "required"

I was quoted a price of $12K not $10K for the FX 400 and all the recommended additions such as clutch and gauges to run the system reliably and safely. Now the price difference for the two systems is shrinking and explains why many people go ahead and pop for the FX 500. $12K for 400 hp is not that competitive. Factor X can justify their price I'm sure. They have had to research and develop a system for a relatively very limited number of cars. In addition the cars are expensive and in most cases provide the gleam in their owners eyes. Factor X has to provide a system that not only holds up, but also does no harm to the cars. At the same time they need to produce performance changes that inspires their customers to get on sites such as this and rave like lunatics in order to sell more systems. Personally, I would love to send my car for a FX 400 treatment, but $12K is more than I can justify. If the CarTek kit provides 400hp for $8k I'm very interested. But again, I won't buy a kit until I see posts raving about the performence change and testifying about reliability and daily use.

 

[MiamieNeSeX]

If the CarTek kit provides 400hp for $8k I'm very interested. .

I think you are low on that price.

And high on the HP

Armando

 

[len3.8]

I think you are low on that price.

Armando

He may be able to buy the kit at that price.If he is buying it just to look at it. :wink: Then find someone to install and tune it. Unless you can do this yourself, include me in the "can't" section, you are going to pay for that. What would that add to the price?
Gauges? Fuel system, is the stock system truly enough?
Having said that, I did not look to see what comes with this system as far as a fuel system. Will you need larger injectors? Will the stock clutch handle the power that you will now introduce to it. (How many miles are on your stock clutch?) Do you want to have an oil cooler or trans cooler?
What safeguards are you going to build into the system to protect your motor? I am not trying to be a smart a$$, just saying that the kit is just the begining. The people that KGP listed and more no what costs are associated with FI. If you want to get something south of 10k, you need to look at the CTSC,BBSC,Gruppe.
It's quite easy to see where the price will end up on this system.

JMO worth about $.01

 

[MiamieNeSeX]

Here's the picture of the slippery slope call Forced Induction, good luck trying to ski it safely for less than $10,000.00 unless you go with a BBSC. lol

Armando